IICSA: survivors speak of influence of religion

[TrueTomHarley]

5 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

Um, very coincidental  AKA ? 

It is my very first AKA. Not Tom Irregardless, but “Me”

https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/686882

[TrueTomHarley]

2 hours ago, César Chávez said:

Do you actually think I care if an idiot suggests it? I fear no one but the man upstairs. Even when JTR made a vague threat, I told him if he was man enough for the challenge, then lets dance.

While the expression “the man upstairs” is very common, I have never heard one of Jehovah’s Witnesses use it, I think because they would assess it as overly familiar and disrespectful of God.

So is CC a Witness or not? Alas, I fear I will never figure it out. 

One man in a million of Jehovah’s Witnesses might use the phrase. That means there could be as many as eight CCs out there.

[TrueTomHarley]

3 hours ago, César Chávez said:

That's because I won't use God's name in vain like you and everyone here. So, the disrespect comes from charlatans trying to make a stupid argument. You're the "fake witness" irregardless not me.

So, trying to equate me with the "8 out there" to be the GB, is one more example how brain-dead you really are. Officially, you are now a stain in the Org.

Come come, I don’t buy it. This is the bluster and abuse of Alan.

Never have I heard a brother refer to God as “the man upstairs” though the expression is common elsewhere. Seldom if ever have I seen a “brother” so abusive, so ready to jettison everything Christ advised whether addressing friend or foe. Even foes he tried to reach, spinning the older son of the Prodigal parable as the one who had been faithful, for example. 

Let’s bring in a few, and hope they don’t mind. Have any of you @JW Insider, @Anna, @The Librarian, @Thinking, @xero,@Outta Here@Arauna(who used be approved by CC, then she “corrected” him, making herself a Jezebel.) Anyone, even the villains, feel free to chime in. Has anyone ever heard a brother call Jehovah “the man upstairs?”

Can he really be a Witness, as he would have everyone believe?

[xero]

1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Come come, I don’t buy it. This is the bluster and abuse of Alan.

Never have I heard a brother refer to God as “the man upstairs” though the expression is common elsewhere. Seldom if ever have I seen a “brother” so abusive, so ready to jettison everything Christ advised whether addressing friend or foe. Even foes he tried to reach, spinning the older son of the Prodigal parable as the one who had been faithful, for example. 

Let’s bring in a few, and hope they don’t mind. Have any of you @JW Insider, @Anna, @The Librarian, @Thinking, @xero,@Outta Here@Arauna(who used be approved by CC, then she “corrected” him, making herself a Jezebel.) Anyone, even the villains, feel free to chime in. Has anyone ever heard a brother call Jehovah “the man upstairs?”

Can he really be a Witness, as he would have everyone believe?

In fact never. I suppose everyone is a "witness" to something. Perhaps some would like to be, but they (like a few I've studied with) could never get their behavior enough in control to make it to baptism. In point of fact it seems it was a kindness of sorts to not allow them to get baptized as they would have soon run afoul and ended up in a judicial situation. Which is sortof odd in a way. You DO want people to get baptized, but this is a symbol, and is ostensibly representing a person who has rejected his former way of life and accepted the office, authority and disciplining of Jehovah, his Son and the holy spirit in its operation.  (Of course I know I'm no paragon of virtue in the aforementioned either).

Of course this is neither here nor there as it goes. There are times when it doesn't matter who a person represents him or herself as - you see what they say and what they do and you respond accordingly. (Or as in a cool feature of the site - you make them disappear)

[Anna]

36 minutes ago, xero said:

Has anyone ever heard a brother call Jehovah “the man upstairs?”

I don't think so. Not in English speaking countries. But I do think CC aka Allen's first language is not English. And then there are all kinds in a congregation, and some are brothers in name only.

What I find strange is that CC aka Allen never calls God by his name...

[TrueTomHarley]

8 hours ago, Anna said:

What I find strange is that CC aka Allen never calls God by his name...

You know, I never noticed that. Though I suppose he would account for it by saying he would never utter the Name before such swine.

9 hours ago, César Chávez said:

That looks a lot like what happened to Allen Smith, being "banned" by a bunch of ungrateful ingrates, and lovers of themselves

This is too much, CC crying over the fate of Allen, just as 4Jah cries over the fate of JB. In either case, it is like the women weeping over Tammuz.  Everyone else was glad to see both of them go, for they both conducted themselves outrageously.

Too bad they were both replaced by another who knows and repeats all their lines syllable by syllable.

[JW Insider]

12 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Never have I heard a brother refer to God as “the man upstairs” though the expression is common elsewhere.

I haven't either. But the topic of using God's name on this channel came up in his "Allen Smith" period, and again in his BTK period. As CC, (assuming the three are one) there has been a consistency of practice. But he has chided/counseled me, even for using my account name which implies Jehovah's name in the abbreviation JW. But that may be more because he doesn't believe I deserve to use the term. But it was in that context (discussing my "handle") that he once brought up the fact that he personally believes that casual use of the Divine Name is out of place here. You might even recall a few uses of "G-d" instead of "God" following a similar Jewish practice.

Note page 8 of another topic:

On 4/12/2020 at 6:41 AM, César Chávez said:

Now to the rabbinic understanding, Elohim was used by G-d himself. This can only come from ancient Hebrew scholars that also accepted Baal by the Israelite's.

So, I'd say there has been a consistency, although he uses it in quotes from others, quotes from sources, and usually only in discussions regarding the use of God's name itself. (Edited to add: BTW, CC's posts on that topic were excellent and thought-provoking, in my opinion.)

[TrueTomHarley]

23 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

the topic of using God's name on this channel came up in his "Allen Smith" period, and again in his BTK period. As CC, (assuming the three are one)

Now, THAT is a trinity I can get my head around!

23 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

he once brought up the fact that he personally believes that casual use of the Divine Name is out of place here.

I respect that and do much the same. For example, just today I put it that “God,” not “Jehovah,” is not expected to send his servant Dirty Harry to unruly ones with the admonishment: “Ya feeling lucky today, punk?”

23 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Edited to add: BTW, CC's posts on that topic were excellent and thought-provoking, in my opinion.)

I will agree he is capable of it. It is a shame he can control neither his temper nor his tongue.

[TrueTomHarley]

4 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

[to JWI] I respect that and do much the same. For example, just today I put it that “God,” not “Jehovah,” is not expected to send his servant Dirty Harry to unruly ones with the admonishment: “Ya feeling lucky today, punk?”

32 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

Here’s another one: 

“After this I saw four angels standing upon the four corners of the earth, holding tight onto Cesar, that he might not blow upon the earth or upon the sea or upon any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the sunrising, and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, “I know it’s hard boys, but try to impress upon him that when the time comes for a hard-hitting judgment message, he will be our go-to guy!”

[xero]

2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Here’s another one: 

“After this I saw four angels standing upon the four corners of the earth, holding tight onto Cesar, that he might not blow upon the earth or upon the sea or upon any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the sunrising, and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, “I know it’s hard boys, but try to impress upon him that when the time comes for a hard-hitting judgment message, he will be our go-to guy!”

 

Reminds me of the brothers who studied w/me. This one brother would bonk me on the head w/his bible when I went on a rant. At other times he say the angels were running around in front of my mouth trying to throw some salt on the words coming out of my mouth.

Not surprising that it happened occasionally that when a HH brought up something designedly antagonistic, I've said a few times "Are you asking because you really want to know, or are just trying to start something?"

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

17 hours ago, xero said:

and accepted the office, authority and disciplining of Jehovah, his Son and the holy spirit in its operation. 

Now this is so funny. Read it again. The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. 

BUT JW Org DOES NOT obey that scripture. To baptise in the name of The Father, The Son and the Holy Spirit. 

 

[JW Insider]

48 minutes ago, César Chávez said:

I believe, you were insinuating, you were a road scholar full of information and insight

Then you would be wrong. I'm not a scholar.

48 minutes ago, César Chávez said:

But, I guess, your intelligence by your comment is limited after all.

Very limited. But evidently still correct, in this case.