Did Carnivores Exist Before the Flood of Noah's Day?

[Srecko Sostar]

Whichever way we interpret it, God accepted Abel’s meat sacrifice rather than Cain’s vegetable sacrifice. And that's proof ..... of what?  

[Srecko Sostar]

Herbivores, carnivores and omnivores. Each of them should have the ability to live from the food they eat. The digestive system, from the entrance to the exit, of food should be adapted to the type of food.
If God created each species for a specific purpose then we should not expect, as suggested in the commentary, that humans and animals (and other organisms) were herbivores before the flood and became carnivores or omnivores after the flood, according to the offered biblical quote,... God gave them all to eat "green grass and herbs" (Gen 1:30).
Moreover, such a possibility of adaptation of so many species of organisms to a sudden change in diet supports the theory that living organisms "adapt" to the natural environment and other changing conditions on Earth. This consequently means that God “created” all organisms in such a way that they can change or evolve in order to be able to live and survive in changed conditions, and for which we still see that it is possible and accurate. This again means that God knew in advance that Adam and Eve would sin, start killing each other, and animals, and eat meat. This means that God knew in advance about the Flood and the change in the diet for all the organisms on Earth, etc. Knowing what the future holds, God equipped the organisms in advance for change.  

The idea or thesis that God would know about every detail of the future is something that WTJWorg rejects in its theology. JW theology says that God has the ability to see the future, but that he is discreet and considerate of people and their free will to such an extent that He does not want to look at the future of each individual and thus enter into someone's privacy. Certainly this kind of explanation has its flaws and does not explain why then God would deal with the future and prophecies if He does not want to see it in advance.

The Bible is a book that is not always clear, not even in terms of theology, let alone to deal with such answers to the question in the subject. The text leaves too much room for conjecture. And to draw various conclusions that do not have to be an indication of accuracy. Only intellectual wandering, imagination and daily politics (daily ideologies).
If God created everything, then he also created organisms, many of which are invisible to the human eye, and which live in someone else's body and at the expense of their host. Some are useful to him, and some are able to torture and kill his host.
Or take for example the behavior of the vast majority of animals, if not all (even humans). The instinct to have and protect or conquer someone else's - food area, place for home, females for mating. So, God instilled in them such an instinct for behavior during creation. And, on the other hand, most societies in today's civilization reject the "biblical concept" of the ancient patriarchs, to whom the described situation was completely natural and approved by God. Both, before the flood and after the Flood, for example polygamy was acceptable. The fact that comes from the biblical text that God created only one woman for Adam was not decisive for future human society, regardless of their religiosity, that people with the blessing of that same God establish families in which a man has more than one wife. Whether they are vegetarians or omnivores.
We could say that God has changed his mind and attitudes and behavior in different circumstances and times throughout history. He changed it in terms of human nutrition (and animals?), And in terms of marital status of people.
Insisting today on any of the theses offered (or practice and way of life) would be limited and would show that we are less adaptable than God who is able in many things to adapt himself to people and their capabilities.

I’ve heard that today’s nutritionists don’t talk about healthy or unhealthy food. All food is healthy to eat.....but not every amount of food. There can only be hygienically unsafe food. You know, in the sense that the expiration date has passed or that the food is in the process of rotting and the like. 

[xero]

These people are the ones who get into this question:

https://answersingenesis.org/animal-behavior/what-animals-eat/creations-original-diet-and-the-changes-at-the-fall/

[Srecko Sostar]

13 hours ago, xero said:

These people are the ones who get into this question:

https://answersingenesis.org/animal-behavior/what-animals-eat/creations-original-diet-and-the-changes-at-the-fall/

It is not difficult to conclude, according to the article, that in fact all plants were supposed to be for human consumption. So, plants with intoxicating ingredients, stronger or weaker, not be wrong to take (marijuana and similar grass/ weeds)  

[Dmitar]

On 12/15/2021 at 2:48 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

It is not difficult to conclude, according to the article, that in fact all plants were supposed to be for human consumption. So, plants with intoxicating ingredients, stronger or weaker, not be wrong to take (marijuana and similar grass/ weeds)

Can you explain your conclusion with that of scripture? Genesis 1:29-30

I believe the caption starts with the word Carnivores. I would also ask the same of the poster with respect to Dinosaurs.

[Dmitar]

On 12/14/2021 at 12:51 PM, xero said:

These people are the ones who get into this question:

Can you clarify your position here with this post? Are you for God's creation, or are you criticizing God for his creation?

[Srecko Sostar]

17 minutes ago, Dmitar said:

Can you explain your conclusion with that of scripture? Genesis 1:29-30

Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food.  And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

quote from article: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/323037#_noHeaderPrefixedContent

Although hemp seeds come from the Cannabis sativa plant, they do not produce a mind-altering effect.

These small, brown seeds are rich in protein, fiber, and healthful fatty acids, including omega-3s and omega-6s. They have antioxidant effects and may reduce symptoms of numerous ailments, improving the health of the heart, skin, and joints.

In this article, we look at the various benefits of hemp seeds and provide tips for adding them to the diet. 

 

[Dmitar]

5 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

In this article, we look at the various benefits of hemp seeds and provide tips for adding them to the diet. 

Your response is none responsive. Can you clarify? You are indicating that man was imperfect in the Garden of Eden, while suggesting there were carnivores in the Garden. As indicated in Genesis, all vegetation was made available for consumption for both man and animal. Before man was created, the animal kingdom was afforded the same vegetation, even though it was denser and course (shrubs), thus giving land animals a set of canine teeth. 

Keep in mind, I'm referring from creation. I'm not referring from the point after Adam and Eve were kicked out of the Garden to before Noah's Flood. After the expulsion of man, evil entities taught man many things, including the usage of certain plants for illicit use. Animals would have used their animal instinct for survival to become carnivore. 

[Srecko Sostar]

4 hours ago, Dmitar said:

Your response is none responsive. Can you clarify? You are indicating that man was imperfect in the Garden of Eden, while suggesting there were carnivores in the Garden. As indicated in Genesis, all vegetation was made available for consumption for both man and animal. Before man was created, the animal kingdom was afforded the same vegetation, even though it was denser and course (shrubs), thus giving land animals a set of canine teeth. 

Keep in mind, I'm referring from creation. I'm not referring from the point after Adam and Eve were kicked out of the Garden to before Noah's Flood. After the expulsion of man, evil entities taught man many things, including the usage of certain plants for illicit use. Animals would have used their animal instinct for survival to become carnivore. 

 

9 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food.  And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

quote from article: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/323037#_noHeaderPrefixedContent

Although hemp seeds come from the Cannabis sativa plant, they do not produce a mind-altering effect.

These small, brown seeds are rich in protein, fiber, and healthful fatty acids, including omega-3s and omega-6s. They have antioxidant effects and may reduce symptoms of numerous ailments, improving the health of the heart, skin, and joints.

In this article, we look at the various benefits of hemp seeds and provide tips for adding them to the diet. 

I am of the opinion that my comment, which I put again, quite simply pointed to the fact that hemp is a plant that carries seeds and that, according to Genesis, it is intended for human consumption. That's all and only that. I wasn’t talking about meat or teeth growing, so it’s not clear to me what’s not clear to you in my comment about hemp. 

If you go back to my comment from before this, and it is for example this:

On 12/12/2021 at 7:47 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

If God created each species for a specific purpose then we should not expect, as suggested in the commentary, that humans and animals (and other organisms) were herbivores before the flood and became carnivores or omnivores after the flood, according to the offered biblical quote,... God gave them all to eat "green grass and herbs" (Gen 1:30).
Moreover, such a possibility of adaptation of so many species of organisms to a sudden change in diet supports the theory that living organisms "adapt" to the natural environment and other changing conditions on Earth. This consequently means that God “created” all organisms in such a way that they can change or evolve in order to be able to live and survive in changed conditions, and for which we still see that it is possible and accurate. This again means that God knew in advance that Adam and Eve would sin, start killing each other, and animals, and eat meat. This means that God knew in advance about the Flood and the change in the diet for all the organisms on Earth, etc. Knowing what the future holds, God equipped the organisms in advance for change.  

and your's:

4 hours ago, Dmitar said:

Before man was created, the animal kingdom was afforded the same vegetation, even though it was denser and course (shrubs), thus giving land animals a set of canine teeth. 

Keep in mind, I'm referring from creation. I'm not referring from the point after Adam and Eve were kicked out of the Garden to before Noah's Flood. After the expulsion of man, evil entities taught man many things, including the usage of certain plants for illicit use. Animals would have used their animal instinct for survival to become carnivore. 

The vast majority of animals do not have fangs, and yet they eat a variety of tough grass, tree bark, prickly cacti and the like. From that, I would conclude that the animals that we later called predators (with fangs) should not have had such types of teeth in the very act of creation, because many other animals are so-called. predators without canines. Owls do not have fangs and yet they successfully kill their prey. What did the owls eat in Eden?

You offer the following explanation: 

4 hours ago, Dmitar said:

Animals would have used their animal instinct for survival to become carnivore. 

After this kind of conclusion, the question arises: Why would God instill in animals an "instinct" that is secretly waiting for a revolution and rebellion of angels and people against God, and then the animals "go crazy" and start killing each other?
If God instilled in animals this kind of instinct in advance then God must have known something we do not know about God, about humans and about animals, so we interpret the Bible book of Genesis in a way that did not take into account other factors.

It is similar with people. Well people have instincts too. Or does someone want to claim that we don’t have them?

[Dmitar]

49 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I am of the opinion that my comment, which I put again, quite simply pointed to the fact that hemp is a plant that carries seeds and that, according to Genesis, it is intended for human consumption. That's all and only that. I wasn’t talking about meat or teeth growing, so it’s not clear to me what’s not clear to you in my comment about hemp. 

Once again, none responsive. Can you clarify? The point you make indicates what Genesis perceives as in the Garden of Eden. There were no evil entities to teach man what kind of plants could be used for illicit purposes. Satan, the father of Evil, condemned man by lying to Eve. That fruit was not illicit but did hold a definitive purpose. 

The topic is structured poorly, however, There seems to be two sets of thought. One from within the Garden (creation) and two, after man was expelled from the Garden. Between, the expulsion and pre-flood, the animal kingdom would not have been disciplined by their own survival to become carnivores out of necessity. After the expulsion of man and pre-flood, Adam and Eve still maintained the diet chosen by God, as indicated in Genesis 3: 17-19.

Since Abel became a Shepherd, scripture at this point does not indicate the animal kingdom had started becoming carnivores. If wasn't until Genesis Chapter 9 after the flood when God granted man the consumption of meat. There too would be the opportunity for the animal kingdom to become carnivores.

Archaeology tells a different story, as do story tellers.

[Pudgy]

11 hours ago, Dmitar said:

I believe the caption starts with the word Carnivores. I would also ask the same of the poster with respect to Dinosaurs.

Which dinosaurs are you interested in ... the elusive Nobodysaurus, known for its stealth using cloth deck shoes ... or the erudite multi-lingual Thesaurus?

[Pudgy]

57 minutes ago, Dmitar said:

If wasn't until Genesis Chapter 9 after the flood when God granted man the consumption of meat.

You, with no understanding at all.

Animals were taken aboard the Ark by twos ... AND BY SEVENS.

During the voyage, some of THE SEVENs were allocated to serve as food for those collected by twos, and by sevens., and even by Noah's Family.

When the Ark landed, there were NO ANIMALS outside the Ark for Noah and his family to eat, so Jehovah gave Noah and his family to eat the surviving subsets of seven unclean animals ON THE ARK.

Mankind had been eating animals since they were thrown outside the garden of Eden ... or do you think Able was a shepherd and hunter because he needed a hobby?

THINK ABOUT IT!!

Why do you think God ordered the UNCLEAN animals collected by sevens, and the CLEAN animals collected ONLY by twos?

BECAUSE Refrigerators had not yet been invented.

When you read the biblical accounts, you are SUPPOSED to use some basic common sense, visualizing what is reasonable and what is a rubber-band stretch .... but as always ... agenda driven thinking ... parroting the screwball ideas one of the Society's Lawyers dreamed up in the 1930's and repeated for 80 years , short circuits rational thinking.