What Happens When A Couple of the Opposite Sex Are Alone?

[Space Merchant]

3 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

@Equivocation No all questions do not have a direct answer, that is worldly thinking. It is trickery just like the Pharisees tried with Jesus. 

Good try, just not good enough... I'll repeat, I will not judge you. How would I know if you are or not. I know nothing about you. Perhaps if i knew you personally for 6 months, then i could make an assumption. But even assumptions can be wrong. Sorry to disappoint you by not falling for your trick. 

I would not oppose you, i would just give you a balanced viewpoint. It would seem that you and others look for opposition deliberately. 

Pretending to be forgiving does not cut any deal with God. 

The answer he gave isn't a trick question, anyone can answer it, and it is a simple no. The reason he asked this because anyone who is affiliated with Jehovah's Witnesses are called pedophiles or lovers of pedophiles, even going as far as to promote and say the Watchtower is a pedophile paradise, anyone who loses an argument to a Jehovah's Witness will jump straight to child abuse, this should be known to you because the man who made mention of before fits that category. Therefore it isn't worldly thinking, it is a question posed by someone who has taken the persecution at full force, for one of his comments stated his JW Church was disrupted, granted he mentioned Neil Gardner (TGA), for you did show support to this guy so you are among the faction, as he refers to him and someone by the name Faithful Slave, it is evident that he is referring to what took place November 5th of last year (https://friendlyatheist.patheos.com/2017/11/09/ex-jehovahs-witnesses-are-crashing-kingdom-hall-meetings-to-talk-about-abuse/) whereas there was a Protest at Warwick and such taken to the streets, mind you, you were quite adamant of protesting and assume it is working. This is the same JW Church whereas a young man was fuming mad regarding someone of whom he is a relationship as the

That being said, you just said you do not judge, how do you know he isn't forgiving when his community was hit a number of times? Like you said, you do not know him, perhaps 6 months due time may help, you do not know his situation when he was the one who made comment about it, explained it here and the other thread. You do not judge, yet you are quick to somehow know who has God's approval and who does not?

Mr. Butler, I think it is time for an evaluation, not all JWs are the same as the ones you met, as you always profess, earthwide.

[Space Merchant]

2 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

I would agree the definition of some words fail with some, especially when it comes to intent. Assertive undermines the reality of some people’s heart to become an excuse to see the true nature of the beast. A good place to start would be with the Proverbs. Ephesians 5:15-17

Meanwhile, I will accept your personal insults as they are intended.

Sadly, regardless of intent, the pushing to one side still exist for some, they do not realize it, they deny it, but it is there. This is why being knowledgeable is key, even it means hearing from both sides and finally going in to seek what the truth of the matter actually is.

[Space Merchant]

5 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

What Happens When A Couple of the Opposite Sex Are Alone?

What happens When a few brothers stay with opposite sex (sister)?  I heard from one elder many years ago how that was situation between few brothers and one single sister in swimming pool. I can not believe myself until today was that really happened, but this elder said that to me with all seriousness how all of them have sex with that sister.  Not know about final outcome.

This is the case with both the religious and the non-religious. Not everyone is okay at times with two people of the opposite sex to hang out alone with each other, the very reason why a chaperone exist, depending on how some people are, they tend to go above and beyond regarding this issue.

The other factor is children now are groomed to think it is okay to commit sexual acts and do so knowingly without their parents or guardian being present, furthermore, you have teen magazines who carter to young folks on how to perform intercourse and such promote sodomy.

So it is not a shock to anyone of Christians, regardless of who they are, to be somewhat overprotecting as a Father to Daughter, on the other side of the spectrum, you have those who say they are Christians, who are not committed to the faith and perform the acts anyways, for example, a Baptist Church, some weeks ago there was something that took place between 2 people of the opposite sexes in the church itself. Who is to blame?

Self Control and a list of other things is needed, one must deaden their body members also and not be a slave and or victim to sexual immorality and brazen conduct.

[JOHN BUTLER]

@Space Merchant Your words : The answer he gave isn't a trick question, anyone can answer it, and it is a simple no. 

Do you know this person well ? I don't know them at all. Therefore I could not answer that question. They asked me if they were a pedophile. How am i supposed to know ?  I cannot say that i think they are or are not. I have nothing to base that decision on.  But you look for any reason to criticise me. So be it. 

And you make accusation saying that, " anyone who loses an argument to a Jehovah's Witness will jump straight to child abuse". That is what i call a blanket statement. And it is an excuse that JW's would use to try to cover up the seriousness of the problem. 

I've told you many times SM, you do not impress me. Nor do you worry me. It's true you have vast knowledge but you pretend to know situations that you do not know, such as actually being a JW. 

I still laugh at anyone that tries to fit me into a category. Anyone that tries to pretend I'm part of a group of this or that. You have no idea.

Maybe if you knew me well you might call me a lone wolf.  I don't need to hang on to others. And I'm not scared of the muck you throw at me. 

God will choose whomever he wants to serve Him. And God will show who the real Faithful Slave is, all in good time.  As for me I will continue to warn others about the dangers of the JW Org, for it would not be a Christian attitude not to warn them. 

I've never said all JW's are pedophiles. What i have said is that the Child Abuse problem within the JW Org is Earthwide.  

[TrueTomHarley]

12 hours ago, Equivocation said:

The man that stopped the disruptive protest is a former Bible Student,  a friend of John Cedars. 

I have the honor of having been banned at the Cedars site. And I was unfailingly nice to him, too. It was an experiment. For the sake of whomever might be reading, I submitted about ten responses to different accusations before getting the heave-ho.

 

[Space Merchant]

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Your words : The answer he gave isn't a trick question, anyone can answer it, and it is a simple no. 

That is because clearly had a reason to ask you such granted his situation, I am at least aware of what happen on November, I spoke of it just as I spoke of ANTIFA, even make a remark of a joke by ExJWs about challenging JW leaders and the promise of not beating and or assassinating them, yes, they did speak these, the same reason why churches that they got to ally with them backed away, thus removing themselves from the presence of those who are for the rally.

 

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Do you know this person well ?

Obviously not, but I do understand where he is coming from, and how he puts his wording together it is obvious you are dealing with a child/teenager, granted that one JW church was filled to the brim with teenagers and older women compared to the number of JW stewards and pastors, elders what have you.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I don't know them at all.

You don't, but you were quick to call his forgiveness of an event that took place months ago as false. Just because he is a JW, that does not exclude his ability to forgive, just like you, he follows what the Bible says about forgiveness, why should be be excluded hence your own words against him?

It makes no sense. And although he feels flustered about the ordeal, he was able to forgive someone such as Neil Gardner, a former JW who had sent death threats and insults, the same ExJw of whom you linked his information before, who took part in what happen in that JW Church and like you, he is from the UK.

Like Paul, you should be getting down to the level of others, for clearly if someone had their church interrupted and taken over a number of times, to the point where the people of the county spoke of the actions of the ExJws as borderline extremism, that alone should tell you something Butler.

You should take my example, perhaps put yourself in his position, how would feel when this has happen? How would you feel that you were, as with your household insulted, and regarding Evo, him being called a pedophile or a lover of pedophile and the mention of what happen to him and his family? Or the shoes of the boyfriend who took a very angry verbal assault to the ExJWs himself only for them to counterpart with shaming and insult?

The bible tells you to be understanding, give yourself a chance do to so.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Therefore I could not answer that question.

It's a simple know, be it you know him or not, surely with his own emotions known, it should be obvious. The young one isn't a pedophile, nor does he support pedophilia, his slight uncomfortable anger stems from the fact that this has happen to his JW Church and him and all in tat Church has been made a mockery of, causing him to feel that something should be said, and he has said it.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I cannot say that i think they are or are not. I have nothing to base that decision on.  But you look for any reason to criticise me. So be it. 

I haven't criticized you, the question is a direct one, very simple. Your No will mean no, simple as that. To say his question was some sort of elaborate trick, that is absurd, granted hi reasoning and why he brought it up was obvious. After all, you did say pedophilia was earthwide, which is simple minded, when the reality is pedophilia is global, everywhere, not solely in one group, something of which I had told you time and time again, even the first time whereas I was very sympathetic towards you but later on that was not the only issue you had, for you didn't express that the first time around.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

And you make accusation saying that, " anyone who loses an argument to a Jehovah's Witness will jump straight to child abuse". That is what i call a blanket statement. And it is an excuse that JW's would use to try to cover up the seriousness of the problem. 

Because it is true, and I had mention proof of this. Whenever a JW speaks about the Bible and or an argument or Debate ensues, the opponent will simply bring up child abuse and will continue to do so until the JW stops speaking, in other instances, they even record them doing so and state all JWs are like this. This is the case where you live in the UK, and because of this it is the very reason why the one called Kathgar is always on the defense of his faith, he does not back down, he brings up facts to claims, and this is how people are at Speaker's Corner, and I recall talking to you about Muslims, they do the same.

As in their word, if anyone who is educated form the faith speaks up, an opponent will not confront them, but they will confront someone who is a novice in the faith.

It isn't a blank statement when such a thing is indeed true. I spoke of it before.

JWs do not use that tactic, only ExJws do, the very reason they make claim that JWs run away and or the like when in reality it is stuff like this that is ongoing and repetitive tactic, even online this takes place. You cannot deny that isn't true.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I've told you many times SM, you do not impress me. Nor do you worry me. It's true you have vast knowledge but you pretend to know situations that you do not know, such as actually being a JW. 

And I told you, I do not care what you think, what I myself care about is the turht of the matter to be known regardless of what it is.

i asked you before to tell me how am I pretending, which is unfounded, so if you want to prove it now I suggest you make the attempt, I grauntee you cannot do a single thing to make the claim a reality.

Having knowledge is good, it does not make one greater or lesser, it allows someone to discern, to teach, to reason, and more.

And I do know the situation, when I professed an actually truth about a Christology, you called me a parrot, not realizing that same information itself came from an ExJW, so I ask you again, how am I pretending, Mr. Butler? Because I can point out the pretending to not judge, but you seemingly do to some degree - like knowing who is approve by God and who isn't, and a list of other things.

Again, I say to you if you want to go down this "pretend" proof, give it a try because that resolve will not help you when you have no proof.

That being said, it is called Bible Hermenuetics, this time I will link it to you so you understand

• https://www.biblicaltraining.org/biblical-hermeneutics/robert-stein
• https://www.britannica.com/topic/study-of-religion
• https://www.britannica.com/topic/textual-criticism

So have at it, show me as to where I am pretending when you could profess truth about the Christology of others, even at some point here about Buddhism on one occasion?

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I still laugh at anyone that tries to fit me into a category. Anyone that tries to pretend I'm part of a group of this or that. You have no idea.

And yet Mr. Gardner was brought up by you and your show of support in terms of protest, to which I made a reply to you about this man months ago. That isn't a joke either.

And like how Prophet Isaiah was with the leaders of Judah, I tell you again - there is good people and there is bad people, and the bad ones do not make up the whole community for their actions. You spoke boldly about your former JW church, it does not define all the churches despite them being in the same faith community, this goes hand in hand as to the very reason why Evo asked you that direct question.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Maybe if you knew me well you might call me a lone wolf.  I don't need to hang on to others. And I'm not scared of the muck you throw at me. 

You do have to be scared because the only thing I speak here is truth. You can be a lone wolf anytime you want, but as with all wolves they meet an alpha of the pack and it does not fair well for them.

You tend to sometimes hang to the words of others, for the last time you confused me for an Interfaith Unitarian based on the words of others, just because I am a Biblical Unitarian it does not automatically align me with Interfaith Unitarians - who do not believe in Pre-Existence if I may had, for this was the same move made by the one before you named Cos, who ended up revealing who his Father truly was.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I've never said all JW's are pedophiles. What i have said is that the Child Abuse problem within the JW Org is Earthwide. 

And yet when one speaks of his ordeal and gives question you consider it a trick, and as I said before, there is good people and bad people. The only reason he brought this up was because of Mr. Gardner of whom he refers to as TGA, which means The Great Apostate. You may not recognize his name, but surely an image will do, after all, you were the one who posted his information regarding his next protest:

 

That being said, I really do not care of what you think of me, you'd be surprise of how many people, even false Christians who want to see me burned at a stake not just because I know too much of the Scriptures or anything pertaining to Shadow Government, but because of my color, despite this, it does not stop me from speaking about God, it does not stop me for speaking truth, from either the bible, Church History or Christology, etc. Because no matter of how many times someone attempts to kick me down, I stand back up without laying a hand on someone and continue to do what God asks of me and the command of the Christ. In this case, I understand that the young one's view on how ExJWs treated him because this was something somewhat big last year along with ANTIFA and the attack on Jews.

Just know this who stopped the very man you support. It took an artist, a gay man and an Ex Bible Student to speak up against people like Gardner,and the churches who didn't know what they were in for, they backed out, let that sink in.

Open your eyes, Butler, perhaps next time re-read what the kid is saying carefully and what his situation is, because he is a JW it does not exclude him to be heard nor his ability for forgive even the likes of Gardner and FS despite what took place.

Despite our difference and as I have done before, even though you are somewhat now aware of what he is referring to, the forgiveness has been made, even towards you, as done before.

 

FYI, just to add with what he is saying, I will do you the favor of the other information regarding the whole boyfriend situation who was very very angry with that video only to be shot down by ExJWs.

[Space Merchant]

@TrueTomHarley I am aware of who he is because the one who topped the protest last year was a friend of Mr. Cedars.

Granted Evo was speaking about the ordeal and it be recognized, that his JW church was the one targeted, granted that was the only JW Church in the Borough of the Passaic County that was interrupted by Gardner and others.

The man who stopped it was attacked so badly by ExJws that other ExJws had to speak, even JWs and the non-religious defended the man from Gardner and his followers. Garner and his followers pushed the man to the point that his videos were removed from YouTube that gave vital insight, even what he suggest about going about problems such as child abuse, but clearly, they were not having it.

I will quote someone from the video, people like this will do anything and everything, even going as far as to destroy Christianity in order to bring down a single faith. It is one thing to speak against falsehood, but a total warpath to cease out  religious faith is crazy.

It did get bad to the point whereas people had to cry to Cedars who he himself made known of the other faction of ExJWs who are clearly against him, those being Gardner and FS; Anti-JWs are excluded because they are just atheists and against all religions.

This is the only information I can find, granted weeks later from the whole ordeal things were being swept, likes about the one who stopped the protest was also spread: https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6519041617297408/exjw-responsible-calling-police-warwick-protest-watchtower

During that time, I as more focused on ANTIFA, I only got to the whole warwick things when someone in another Christian community spoke about it briefly and mentioned this date 11/5/17.

[Space Merchant]

1 hour ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Being banned from an apostate site has nothing to do with professionalism or etiquette. They just don’t want people to bring honesty and bring the truth to their wicked doorsteps. Many of these websites are affiliated by one common web carrier.

It has always spread to other social media sites and on YouTube. I remember a Catholic guy sat down with a JW to speak, a peaceful discussion, however because JW was in the title, everyone who followed Cedars, Gardner, FS and a list of others bombarded the comment section, resulting in the video going private. Another situation is elsewhere during a discussion, they pop up there also, as seen on this link. 

One can agree/disagree with someone, but to go as far as to incite hatred or infighting is a whole other level.

As for that book, people do not understand that God knows who is for him and who is not. They watered down what God will do and confuse his Justice. People do not know that if it things is going to be as bad as Noah's Day, as bad as Sodom and Gormorrah, it will happen. In a sense, they sort of Disney-fied God and Jesus, for Disney is known for taking messed up and brutal stories and making it kid friendly, one cannot do this with the Bible, for over time people will need to learn of what is to come and anyone who takes up the Word of God and his Christ will be saved.

I had a discussion with someone else here, who watered down what Jesus would do to the wicked, for if the Son of the True God does the Will of the Father and cannot do a single thing unless the Father tells him, he will do it. God himself said he will get rid of the wicked and will indeed do so through his chosen Christ, his Son, Jesus. But this simple truth they do not want to accept when the Bible even tells them that.

[JOHN BUTLER]

@BillyTheKid46 Quote "It’s unfortunate former members market the conspiracy theories instead of speaking about their normal lives and why they were disfellowshipped". 

Wow how sly is that ? If no one else can see it, it is giving the impression that no one leaves the JW Org, they only get disfellowshipped. 

Sorry to burst your bubble Billy but many of us actually choose to leave the JW Org. Or as they will put it we Disassociate ourselves from JW Org. And yes it would be wonderful to hear why so many leave the Org of their own choice. 

 

[Space Merchant]

9 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Wow how sly is that ? If no one else can see it, it is giving the impression that no one leaves the JW Org, they only get disfellowshipped. 

It is practically true regarding conspiracy.

10 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Sorry to burst your bubble Billy but many of us actually choose to leave the JW Org. Or as they will put it we Disassociate ourselves from JW Org. And yes it would be wonderful to hear why so many leave the Org of their own choice. 

True, but some former JWs are not like their atheist and or disgruntled counterparts, these same ones even defend their former faith, even speaking against conspiracy. This is the same case with other Abrahmic Faiths that follow the earliest teachings.

[JOHN BUTLER]

5 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

While I can understand the assumption made, I cannot link the comment I offered to other than the author I was describing. Kyria

However, I can see where people as yourself might want to include all, as it has become a gesture in common with your remarks. Perhaps this is the area, Equivocation had a problem with. Linking members with the organization.

The idea that those that faded, stopped going, or simply resigned out of their own free will, doesn’t exclude the fact they will find an insistence to align themselves to the prosecution of the Watchtower, and its members. This comprises with their own personal reasons why they left. I cannot see a positive circumstance that a former witness has stated, I left the organization out of my own free will, and I find myself to be in 100% agreement with the Watchtower. I found my behavior to be at fault, and I cannot in all conscious subject my ways of not accepting god's commands to the other members of the Watchtower.

I believe you made yourself a prime example of that. The conspiracy theory then continues.

 

instead of speaking about their normal lives and why they were disfellowshipped. 

Their,  plural.. they plural.  Seems clear to me you were including a quantity of people. Singular would  probably been his/her, he,she. 

So how is that conspiracy ? 

Maybe the conspiracy comes from you and your accusation that "The idea that those that faded, stopped going, or simply resigned out of their own free will ,doesn’t exclude the fact they will find an insistence to align themselves to the prosecution of the Watchtower, and its members. 

A bit of a blanket statement it seems. I get moaned at for doing such things when i say Child Abuse is Earthwide in the JW org. But you think it's fine because you sit on high judging Ex JW's. 

[JOHN BUTLER]

11 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Then it can be said you harbor the same for active witnesses within the organization. Credibility, however you want to define it, has no sensible reasoning with troubled souls. They just want to justify their actions at any cost. Then, judgment falls in their doorstep, not others. There lies the difference in judgment and conspiracy. That attitude nullifies all credibility no matter what when activism is generated by misguided intent.

It's unfortunate the parallels have not made its way to understanding the intent I'm attempting to convey with your own behavior, about judgment, holding the Watchtower responsible, and making all members the same. Perhaps, it will someday.

It is said that i do "harbor the same for active witnesses within the organization." However the person that says such is lying.  Because I don't 'make all members the same', as you pretend. 

If i say there are vehicles all over the earth,  I am not saying that everyone is a vehicle driver.  Similarly I say that there is Child Abuse within the JW Org earthwide, but I'm not sayin every JW is a pedophile... What I'm saying is that the danger of Child Abuse exists in every congregation of JW's because it is known that it has occured in many congregations before. And I'm also stating as fact that the GB have known about it for a very long time and it has been kept 'hidden' within the JW Org. 'Hidden' in a way that it is now just becoming known earthwide by people in general. 

And does a person really have to justify wanting to rid an organisation of Child Abuse ? Surely the GB should have to justify why they haven't acted on it sooner ? 

Kid, I think you may possibly be the 'troubled soul', hiding your head in the sand.  Don't you want the JW Org to be clean ?