Anybody want to flee now?

[Arauna]

37 minutes ago, Kosonen said:

if you had me in mind.

No dear.... relax.... but thanks for caring. 

[Arauna]

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

that about 5,000 or so have left the

We have quite a few Russians here in Rep of Georgia because they do not need a Visa here. Two sisters from Ossetia. 

For Norway or other countries they have to work and apply for residence or apply for asylum. Most ex-Russian countries are now starting to persecute JWs......especially  those who still have Russian mindset but do not include countries which are part of NATO.

[Arauna]

On 4/7/2020 at 3:56 PM, JW Insider said:

saw encamped armies surrounding the city. As far as we can tell, this full siege didn't actually happen until 70, but there must have been some kind of "surrounding" by Gallus' armies before they tried to breach the city in 66. This would have been quite visible, and Jewish guerrilla forces were reported to be quite active drumm

Roman armies would definitely have camped just out of reach of arrow fire, building siege engines and ramps in 66CE. They had breached a part of the wall and suddenly left when Vespasian legions were needed elsewhere.

 

17 hours ago, Kosonen said:

am sure the requirements are very high

It is not by works but as you say, to be pure from this world and have the personality reflecting the Spirit of Jehovah. (5 virgins did not have enough oil - not enough of jehovahs spirit) . But keep in mind they receive undeserved kindness from Jehovah like everyone else.

[Kosonen]

On 4/6/2020 at 5:18 AM, JW Insider said:

Therefore, if people say to you, ‘Look! He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out; . . .

It makes me wonder whether Jesus already knew there would be people thinking they could convince others to flee to a wilderness.

Well, Revelation 12 speaks about "the woman" that will flee into a wilderness. So we need to be able to distinguish the difference with that and the statement Jesus gave  Therefore, if people say to you, ‘Look! He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out; .

So the evident difference is that Jesus warned about people that claim that they have found Jesus literally returned into a wilderness. That would be false, because Jesus will not return to the earth to dwell in the wilderness. Because Jesus said his return will be evident on the sky just as a lightening is visible on the sky. 

Matthew 24: 26  Therefore, if people say to you, ‘Look! He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out; ‘Look! He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it.+ 27  For just as the lightning comes out of the east and shines over to the west, so the presence* of the Son of man will be.

So, a flight to a wilderness does not fall into that category. Because the "woman" in Revelation 12 does not flee to the wilderness to look for Jesus. Instead as Revelation  12 says, she will flee there to escape Satan and the persecution he causes and according to God's will she needs to be there to be fed spiritually. 

Actually there is yet so much the great crowd needs to learn about Jesus' teachings.  

 

[Kosonen]

On 4/6/2020 at 5:18 AM, JW Insider said:

Perhaps it would be nice if many of us could take a long, expensive flight to Australia

Revelation 12:14  But the two wings of the great eagle were given to the woman, so that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is to be fed for a time and times and half a time away from the face of the serpent.

The two wings of the great eagle is an interesting detail. And that she might fly. Yes, really this seems to indicate that the fleeing will happen by flying literally. That is fully possible in our modern time. And cattle ranches, or as they are called in Australia cattle stations, usually have their own runways for planes. Australia is mostly very flat country. So it is easy to put in place runways there in remote rural areas.

[Kosonen]

On 4/6/2020 at 5:18 AM, JW Insider said:

Are you recommending a specific time to leave?

No, not yet. Now we are stuck with travel restrictions. We can't even if we wished. We are in a similar position as were the first century Christians in Jerusalem in year 66 when the Romans were attacking Jerusalem. The Christians had to wait till the Romans would retreat to be able to flee. Similarly we need to wait the Covid-19 pandemic to "retreat" so that travel restrictions would be lifted. 

I would suggest the WT organization organize for that an international assembly in a remote place in Australia, and we all travel there and then just stay there.

We should just follow the same pattern as did the Israelites when they wanted to leave Egypt. Moses told Pharaoh that they want just to go a 3 day distance into the wilderness to have a holy assembly there for their God Jehovah. 

Exodus 3:18 "and you will go, you and the elders of Israel, to the king of Egypt, and you men should say to him: ‘Jehovah the God of the Hebrews has communicated with us. So, please, let us make a three-day journey into the wilderness so that we may sacrifice to Jehovah our God.’

Exodus 5:1 "Afterward, Moses and Aaron went in and said to Pharʹaoh: “This is what Jehovah the God of Israel says, ‘Send my people away so that they may celebrate a festival to me in the wilderness.’” 

In that way we could get tourist visas to enter Australia. We all "just" come there to a international convention.  

[Kosonen]

On 4/6/2020 at 5:18 AM, JW Insider said:

And why this place in particular? Is it a wilderness that has some connection to the word wilderness in Revelation 12:6?

Yes, there is a connection. The "woman" in Revelation 12 is depicted with a crown of 12 stars. Queens usually had crowns on thier heads. So the woman is a sort of queen. And that part of Australia is Queensland. 

And Revelation 12:6 says that God would have prepared that place in advance for the "woman's" arrival: "And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God and where they would feed her for 1,260 days."

The remote places in Queensland are prepared with waterwells, because they are occupied by cattle stations. So the access to water is established there already. And meat is at hand, because of the cattle stations. 

And the climate is suitable. It is not a problem to live in tents year round there. It does not get too cold there. 

[Kosonen]

On 4/6/2020 at 7:55 AM, Arauna said:

Australia and Japan are in fear of China because china is becoming aggressive in its territorial aspirations. China has already bribed most Indonesian countries

That is true. Good that you are aware of the situation. In fact that confirms that Australia is the place were to flee. Because Gog is to come to plunder us who have fled to that remote place. That fit China and their aspirations to take the resources in Australia. Ezekiel 38 explicitly tells what Gog wants to plunder.

Many Bible translations have the complete list of things according to the original text. And the things Gog wants to rob is according to the Bible: Cattle, gold, silver and goods. 

Ezekiel 38:11-13 https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ezekiel+38%3A11-14&version=RSV

11 and say, ‘I will go up against the land of unwalled villages; I will fall upon the quiet people who dwell securely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having no bars or gates’; 12 to seize spoil and carry off plunder; to assail the waste places which are now inhabited, and the people who were gathered from the nations, who have gotten cattle and goods, who dwell at the center of the earth. 13 Sheba and Dedan and the merchants of Tarshish and all its villages will say to you, ‘Have you come to seize spoil? Have you assembled your hosts to carry off plunder, to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to seize great spoil?’

 

In the link here below are many different translations of Ezekiel 38:13 naming explicitely cattle as part of the coveted spoil Gog want to put his hands on. That is for  meat. 

https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Ezekiel 38%3A13

And gold and silver. So we who will be there should be able to find a lot of gold and silver. And that is not a farfetched idea, because there is gold and silver in Australia. There are also abandoned gold mines that still contain gold, just waiting to be mined. And after heavy rains, gold can be washed up on riverbeds. 

 

[Kosonen]

On 4/6/2020 at 7:55 AM, Arauna said:

The new vaccinations against Corona will ensure it..... they are talking about putting a chip in the vaccination so you will not be able to travel if you do not scan it in and have the right traveling credentials.

That's right. At that point it will be too late to flee.

[Kosonen]

On 4/6/2020 at 7:55 AM, Arauna said:

Bottom line:  In previous historical times there were places to flee to but everyone has now run out of places.... and you will not qualify as a "migrant"  if you come from a first world country.

But it would not be a problem if we went to a international convention in Australia and then the second wave of Covid-19 strikes and all travel is again forbidden. Then we would just be stuck in Australia. That would be brilliant timing!

On 4/6/2020 at 7:55 AM, Arauna said:

No place to hide...... only in your room on your knees where Jehovah says you can wait on him  OR with your fellow believers in prison.

Only no place to hide if one did not flee to the place that will enjoy peace, prosperity and calm until Gog tries to attack. But he will not be able, because he will be wiped out before he is able to attack.

Ezekiel 38:11 and say, ‘I will go up against the land of unwalled villages; I will fall upon the quiet people who dwell securely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having no bars or gates’; 12 to seize spoil and carry off plunder; to assail the waste places which are now inhabited, and the people who were gathered from the nations, who have gotten cattle and goods, who dwell at the center of the earth. 13 Sheba and Dedan and the merchants of Tarshish and all its villages will say to you, ‘Have you come to seize spoil? Have you assembled your hosts to carry off plunder, to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to seize great spoil?’

14 “Therefore, son of man, prophesy, and say to Gog, Thus says the Lord God: On that day when my people Israel are dwelling securely, you will bestir yourself

So, according to the Bible those who have come to this place of refuge will dwell in security. That excludes any form of persecution. 

On 4/6/2020 at 10:11 PM, Arauna said:

It is not called a 'quiet' place but a 'secure' place.  Look at the scripture again...It speaks of a land.... . Remember, JWs are a nation who live all over the earth. (The chapter indicates this nation has been restored from all the nations of the earth).  A nation has a country or a.... 'land'.  But we are spread over the earth? 

Yes, we are spread over the earth now, but after we gather together in the wilderness we will be in one area. 

And it will be in a remote area where we can be far away from worldy people. There are cattle stations in Australia that are for example 50 x 100 kilometers big. The only people who live there are the owners of the cattle station and their staff. For a such cattle station there is about 15 staff persons only. So if the WT organization bought a such cattle station or several such ones, then we could live there really peacably without disturbance. It would be very quiet there. Just open rural country with some cows and we ourselves.

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

After WW I, there was only one populated place on Earth that had no cases of the "Spanish Flu"

American Samoa, in the Pacific Ocean ... because they locked down their borders 100%

[Anna]

8 hours ago, Kosonen said:

would suggest the WT organization organize for that an international assembly in a remote place in Australia, and we all travel there and then just stay there.

I don't know if you have thought about it from a practical point of view, but to water and feed over 8 million people for even a short period of time in some remote place would be impossible in my opinion. Also, where would they all sleep, and clean themselves and use the toilet? ....?