WATCHTOWER, 1991 - "HOW TO CHOOSE THE RIGHT RELIGION"

[Anna]

4 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

Thinking, I know Almighty God has the power, and I know He will work through Jesus Christ, and i have previously said what i think God will do in this case

But please remember that John Butler was removed from this forum for saying just that. 

That's utter rubbish. Please @The Librariantell us, why was @JOHN BUTLER removed?

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

9 hours ago, Anna said:

That's utter rubbish. Please @The Librariantell us, why was @JOHN BUTLER removed?

John Butler was removed for suggesting that the GB might be removed and replaced. 

Then Billy the Kid twisted it that John Butler was threatening the GB. That upset some JW Elders here and it was taken as fact without any proof being required. 

John Butler was not even given one warning. He was just removed.  But this is all totally off topic. 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

11 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

She continues to chime in about her being “cheated” out of her anointed status.

Show us proof of this please.  Witness is concerned for the welfare of the Anointed ones. You, it seems, are not.

You seem to be such a 'physical man' that you seem to lack any feeling for the Anointed as spiritual ones. 

11 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

physically gather together.

They physically gather together because the GB are mostly Americans and all in America.

11 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Should they need a replacement, they look into the ranks of anointed worldwide, and select one.

The difference being that they will be replaced by ones of God's choosing through Christ.  You still keep looking at men choosing men. Still so physical. Wake up, think in a spiritual way. God and Christ are not physical.... 

11 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

that their assignment was to rule in the new system, not now.

Um, let me think now. Who is ruling now ? Oh yes, the GB, who say they are Anointed. Those 8 men that say they are the ONLY Faithful and Discreet Slave. Those 8 men that say that 'God and Christ trusts them, so the whole JW congregation should trust them'.   Yes that's who's ruling now. 

[TrueTomHarley]

35 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

John Butler was removed for suggesting that the GB might be removed and replaced. 

Ah—now we are on to something. Did he suggest like any old person floating a possibility? Or did he SUGGEST like Trump, that all was not well in Congress?

Gasp! That’s why Trump was impeached! @The Librarianwas running the House! It was off with Butler’s head one day, Trump’s the next!

[Srecko Sostar]

2 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Should they need a replacement, they look into the ranks of anointed worldwide, and select one.

The difference being that they will be replaced by ones of God's choosing through Christ.  You still keep looking at men choosing men. Still so physical. Wake up, think in a spiritual way. God and Christ are not physical.... 

3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

that their assignment was to rule in the new system, not now.

Um, let me think now. Who is ruling now ? Oh yes, the GB, who say they are Anointed. Those 8 men that say they are the ONLY Faithful and Discreet Slave. Those 8 men that say that 'God and Christ trusts them, so the whole JW congregation should trust them'.   Yes that's who's ruling now. 

Is there any clear and "theocratic" foundation about number of FDS or number of GB or number of Helpers? Just for the sake of discussion. :))

12 apostles need "replacement" for 1 they lost. I mean, they can worked with 11 just fine, didn't they? What is the minimum number of GB members to be Legitimate, according to the Company Charter, according to the Companies Act (secular law), to the Bible, to Jesus, etc.?

And yes, @4Jah2me remarked excellently on the details of who should choose the "leadership." Supposedly, Jesus chose GB in 1919. So "we" would expect how Jesus have to pick the person for task of "feeding", not GB members. They (GB) can make choice about elders in conversation with CO. :))

 

[xero]

I think a lot of JW's are losing their minds right now. Expectation is making the heart sick. I get it.

I look at Christendom and see that their scripturally incorrect views give them an advantage of sorts insofar as these believe, in the main that death leads immediately to a resurrection. This is a lie, of course, but if you believe the lie, you then aren't really waiting for anything. Armageddon and the ultimate righting of wrong becomes a nebulous idea so far off so as to cause them to take no notice. They just get of with living.

W/JWs...The frustration I see comes from all the not knowing. Many believed at one time or another that they really knew. I was worried when I started pioneering that I wouldn't be able to get enough hours under my belt before the end came. Clearly I was wrong. Then I thought about it all and researched all the groups who really believed the end was close at hand. There have been many. It's hard to be in a state of readiness if you really believe that some super important thing is going to happen this takes a toll on both your body and your mind. You can get into a sort of PTSD. People have differing reactions too to information given. No one listens to a talk or reads a publication without creating a narrative or movie, filling in the gaps with themselves. The anxiety can build up in people and then like a human immune system it may select a target to attack. Many are focused on the GB or anointed or these kinds of things. I get it. These things are not the real reasons. The real reasons come from all the not knowing while being in a state of stress.

This is where you have to go back. Pump the brakes and pray. Jehovah is in charge. Jehovah created this universe (through his Son) and his son said "take courage, I have conquered the world". Read carefully the book of Job. Keep studying. Don't stop living. Don't go towards hating on the world, hating on apostates, hating on the GB, hating on anything. Understand that the real enemy is in the spirit realm. Understand that you yourself can be your own enemy with your own thinking and obsessions. Meditate on what it means to wait, what is it doing to you.

I jumped out of a plane by myself once with only a morning's worth of training. It felt like suicide. During the training (over a high jump pit) we were told how to spot and deal w/a parachute malfunction - how to discard the tangled chute and deploy your reserve. The bikers running the jump site freaked out the guy in front of me and he didn't jump. They joked "You'd be lucky to get a malfunction - you get two rides for the price of one!" But they also told us once we got a chute to be sure we got lined up properly for a landing and relax and look up (don't look down) when you're one your way to a landing, otherwise the landing would be too hard as you'd stiff up and maybe break a leg. (we used old Vietnam era chutes, not the fancy kinds). So to me the illustration is to be sure you have yourself lined up right, and when you do relax and look up (not at your bro/sis/GB/world) and you'll stick the landing.

If you're feeling anxiety, you're in good company. Just make sure while you feel trapped you don't chew off your own leg or the legs of those around you. The trap isn't your bros/sis's/elders/gb... it's this world under Satan's influence. You fight the trap by following as closely as you can the patterns set  which lead to faith. Just be sure that when you see another human that you imitate faith based on the promises in the bible.

Eat right, get regular exercise, find something to do which you enjoy and do what you can and learn to ignore the ones who imagine they know you and what you can do better. (I'm still working on all of this too)

[The Librarian]

4 hours ago, Anna said:

That's utter rubbish. Please @The Librariantell us, why was @JOHN BUTLER removed?

He was removed for calling for physical harm to the extreme upon a member of the GB if I remember correctly.

[TrueTomHarley]

3 hours ago, xero said:

Don't go towards hating on the world, hating on apostates, hating on the GB, hating on anything.

Yes. This is why I am nothing but hugs and kisses for Alan, Witness, and even that insufferable 4Jah.

3 hours ago, xero said:

Understand that the real enemy is in the spirit realm.

Exactly. This is why you do not pay undo attention to the individuals. They are as actors in a play. Take one out and another who knows all the lines immediately steps into his place.

This is true even with the good guys, though they are more pleasant to dwell upon and might be dwelt upon for just that reason. It is the play we are watching. One need not know the names of the actors to follow the play. It can even be a distraction if we do 

[Thinking]

9 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

He was not removed for that reason.

Look, nothing has changed with this new identification of the GB with the faithful slave. Before that was made the situation was the same. Headship came from a small group of under a dozen who, for practical reasons, physically gather together. Should they need a replacement, they look into the ranks of anointed worldwide, and select one. It was that way before. It is that way now. 

Who do you think they are going to select? Someone who just recently began to partake, or one who has done so for a long time? Someone with relatively little experience in the Christian preaching work, or one who has specialized in it full-time for decades?

This is not hard to answer. Even before this arrangement, anointed within the congregations knew, were content with, and deported themselves, that their assignment was to rule in the new system, not now. But it has apparently become the thing that there are now some anointed, whether for real or “self-promoted”  I know not, whether associated with a congregation or on the outside I know not, who want to be NOW seen as having authority. It has never been that way. 

As far as I am concerned, Witness’s non-response to my request that she arrange the car group says it all. She bitterly complains on how sisters with many children are “ignored.” When I ask how would she handle the situation she herself presented she is silent. Yet she is not silent on everything. She continues to chime in about her being “cheated” out of her anointed status.

Someone really anointed, someone really concerned with the sheep, would not ignore the scenario she presented herself as a complaint. She would tell how it is solved. She may have been like that at one time. But she appears far too interested in self-promotion” these days for her to be so now.

Someone really anointed or really Invited  would not promote or make it known on line ...it’s as simple as that..a really humble one ..would allow them selves  be wronged..as Jesus did and as the apostles did..

PRIDE makes them have the need to be known.....

[Thinking]

4 hours ago, xero said:

I think a lot of JW's are losing their minds right now. Expectation is making the heart sick. I get it.

I look at Christendom and see that their scripturally incorrect views give them an advantage of sorts insofar as these believe, in the main that death leads immediately to a resurrection. This is a lie, of course, but if you believe the lie, you then aren't really waiting for anything. Armageddon and the ultimate righting of wrong becomes a nebulous idea so far off so as to cause them to take no notice. They just get of with living.

W/JWs...The frustration I see comes from all the not knowing. Many believed at one time or another that they really knew. I was worried when I started pioneering that I wouldn't be able to get enough hours under my belt before the end came. Clearly I was wrong. Then I thought about it all and researched all the groups who really believed the end was close at hand. There have been many. It's hard to be in a state of readiness if you really believe that some super important thing is going to happen this takes a toll on both your body and your mind. You can get into a sort of PTSD. People have differing reactions too to information given. No one listens to a talk or reads a publication without creating a narrative or movie, filling in the gaps with themselves. The anxiety can build up in people and then like a human immune system it may select a target to attack. Many are focused on the GB or anointed or these kinds of things. I get it. These things are not the real reasons. The real reasons come from all the not knowing while being in a state of stress.

This is where you have to go back. Pump the brakes and pray. Jehovah is in charge. Jehovah created this universe (through his Son) and his son said "take courage, I have conquered the world". Read carefully the book of Job. Keep studying. Don't stop living. Don't go towards hating on the world, hating on apostates, hating on the GB, hating on anything. Understand that the real enemy is in the spirit realm. Understand that you yourself can be your own enemy with your own thinking and obsessions. Meditate on what it means to wait, what is it doing to you.

I jumped out of a plane by myself once with only a morning's worth of training. It felt like suicide. During the training (over a high jump pit) we were told how to spot and deal w/a parachute malfunction - how to discard the tangled chute and deploy your reserve. The bikers running the jump site freaked out the guy in front of me and he didn't jump. They joked "You'd be lucky to get a malfunction - you get two rides for the price of one!" But they also told us once we got a chute to be sure we got lined up properly for a landing and relax and look up (don't look down) when you're one your way to a landing, otherwise the landing would be too hard as you'd stiff up and maybe break a leg. (we used old Vietnam era chutes, not the fancy kinds). So to me the illustration is to be sure you have yourself lined up right, and when you do relax and look up (not at your bro/sis/GB/world) and you'll stick the landing.

If you're feeling anxiety, you're in good company. Just make sure while you feel trapped you don't chew off your own leg or the legs of those around you. The trap isn't your bros/sis's/elders/gb... it's this world under Satan's influence. You fight the trap by following as closely as you can the patterns set  which lead to faith. Just be sure that when you see another human that you imitate faith based on the promises in the bible.

Eat right, get regular exercise, find something to do which you enjoy and do what you can and learn to ignore the ones who imagine they know you and what you can do better. (I'm still working on all of this too)

Brilliant advice!

[Anna]

4 hours ago, The Librarian said:

He was removed for calling for physical harm to the extreme upon a member of the GB if I remember correctly.

And as everyone knows, calling for harm to anyone is against all internet rules globally.   

[Witness]

10 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

As far as I am concerned, Witness’s non-response to my request that she arrange the car group says it all. She bitterly complains on how sisters with many children are “ignored.” When I ask how would she handle the situation she herself presented she is silent. Yet she is not silent on everything. 

Oh my goodness.   Perhaps if you had been there, you might have noticed the prejudice - I say, might.

#1 The sisters decided to arrange themselves, reaching out to others (sisters)  to help them…before showing up for the service meeting.  

#2 – As a good elder’s wife, I eventually told my husband who was the service overseer, that it was a repetitive problem during the week. From what I remember, he said he would address it.  

Does that answer your question?

10 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

She continues to chime in about her being “cheated” out of her anointed status.

Can you please tell me where I have stated that I, personally, was cheated out of my anointed status?   You should be concerned about the cheating of all the anointed out of their status as God's priests in the organization.  I am so glad I am not part of the organization, and no I would never go back to make sure I wasn't "cheated" out of my anointed status. 

You have chosen to remain in the dark about "Israel".  

Someone here said the anointed are not to rule until the Kingdom arrives.  I'm just attaching my comment here.  

1 Pet 2:5,9 - As you come to him, a living stone—rejected by people but chosen and honored by God— 5 you yourselves, as living stones, a spiritual house, are being built to be a holy priesthood to offer spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

 But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his possession, so that you may proclaim the praises of the one who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light. 

This is written in the present tense.  The apostles set the standard for God's priests to follow while on earth.   But since the Wt has developed, Jesus must call God's priests OUT OF DARKNESS, now.  (Rev 3:18; 2:14,15,20,21;18:4-8)  If they remain faithful to Jesus, they will "proclaim praises" about God and Christ.  Those who have left, fully understand the darkness that you choose to live under.  There is no possibility of God's priests to act upon the posted scriptures while under the rulership of a wicked slave.