Exact, per capita donations now "encouraged" from the platform at assemblies?

[Evacuated]

13 minutes ago, Shiwiii said:

I think you are dodging the topic

Are you reading minds again? Tsk! Tsk! 

I don't need to dodge this topic? It makes perfect sense to me. You just can't accept that telling people how much it costs to run an assembly is quite normal and practical. That's not how you feel. Not everyone feels the same way as you do. You will just have to accept that.

[Shiwiii]

8 minutes ago, Gone Away said:

Are you reading minds again? Tsk! Tsk! 

I don't need to dodge this topic? It makes perfect sense to me. You just can't accept that telling people how much it costs to run an assembly is quite normal and practical. That's not how you feel. Not everyone feels the same way as you do. You will just have to accept that.

The question posed was "How is this different from "passing the plate", it is not. You said you couldn't comprehend that,  and now you are telling me? 

The fact of the matter is that it is exactly the same thing, to cover costs associated with whatever religious events the group puts on, no matter if they are Catholic/Hindu/Christian/jws. 

[TrueTomHarley]

Listen to @Gone Away, Shwiiiiiiii. He has a handle on reality 

[JOHN BUTLER]

5 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

 

 

Are you both serious? Really? 

You mean to tell me that you cannot see the similarities between passing the plate and requesting money? Had this come from the Catholic church encouraging their members to fork over some money, you two would be going over some dialog in your minds of how jws are so much better because the jws don't do that. The fact of the matter is ALL churches do it. They all do it for the same exact reasons stated here and elsewhere, to cover expenses. Do some spend it frivolously and are wasteful? Sure. Is any one group innocent in their dealings with the peoples money 100% of the time, probably not. Are there some who try to use the money responsibly? No doubt. But to look down your nose at another group while ignoring your own actions is the perfect definition of hypocrisy.    

Or maybe some do it (GB of JW Org) to pay off the fines and pay off the victims of Child Abuse. And it's funny how many payments are done in secret with the victims not allowed to tell how much they received..... Well that money has to come from somewhere. 

I do believe even the individual congregations are not allowed to keep their own money now. They have to hand over any 'extra' that they may have been keeping for repairs etc...  So remember folks when you put your money in the little box, you are paying to keep those pedophiles hidden in the congregations................  

[Evacuated]

1 hour ago, Shiwiii said:

The fact of the matter is that it is exactly the same thing, to cover costs associated with whatever religious events the group puts on, no matter if they are Catholic/Hindu/Christian/jws.

Look, even the most basic comprehension of this topic demonstrates its pathetic reasoning. Covering costs is exactly what Jehovah's Witnesses are about, hence a per capita assessment, which makes perfect economic sense. You are presenting this (covertly) as if it were comparable to a levy, such as the tithing arrangement so favoured by some, or, as explicitly stated as a "passing the plate" excercise similar to that carried out customarily by others. I am not going to argue the case further on that point, but I would suggest a more careful marshalling of facts is really in order here.

To compare Jehovah's Witnesses discussions on necessary contributions for the funding of religious activities to those of organisations  such as "Catholic/Hindu/Christian/" (and I am sure you would include other groups in your representative listing), seems a benighted position to take.

Literally decades ago, the following observation was made by respected academics, R. Stark & L. R. Iannaccone, regarding the prudent use of resources by Jehovah's Witnesses: 

"In 1992, the combined efforts of the Protestant churches of the United States and Canada sustained 41,142 overseas missionaries at a cost of more than $2 billion a year (Siewert & Kenyon, 1993). That same year, there were 3,279,270 “ overseas” Jehovah’s Witness publishers (nearly all of whom were native-speakers of the language of their mission area) operating on a total budget of $45 million (Yearbook, 1993: 33, 40). That is 80 times as many missionaries for a tiny fraction of the cost." (Journal of Contemporary Religion, Vol.12, No2, 1997).

Jehovah's Witnesses are quite happy to contribute both time and cost-covering money to furthering the interests of what they consider to be God's Kingdom at this time. And that includes direction on costs, along with information on cost-effective and efficient methods to make financial contributions to cover those costs.

So basically, Get over it! It is patently obvious that value for money when it comes to the activities of Jehovah's Witnesses is beyond criticism. Not beyond jealousy however, (Ez.38:11-12).

These other groups you mention appear to be covering far more than costs.

[Evacuated]

53 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I do believe even the individual congregations are not allowed to keep their own money now. They have to hand over any 'extra' that they may have been keeping for repairs etc...  So remember folks when you put your money in the little box, you are paying to keep those pedophiles hidden in the congregations................  

You're outa touch my baby, my poor old fashioned baby........

[JOHN BUTLER]

3 minutes ago, Gone Away said:

Look, even the most basic comprehension of this topic demonstrates its pathetic reasoning. Covering costs is exactly what Jehovah's Witnesses are about, hence a per capita assessment, which makes perfect economic sense. You are presenting this (covertly) as if it were comparable to a levy, such as the tithing arrangement so favoured by some, or, as explicitly stated as a "passing the plate" excercise similar to that carried out customarily by others. I am not going to argue the case further on that point, but I would suggest a more careful marshalling of facts is really in order here.

To compare Jehovah's Witnesses discussions on necessary contributions for the funding of religious activities to those of organisations  such as "Catholic/Hindu/Christian/" (and I am sure you would include other groups in your representative listing), seems a benighted position to take.

Literally decades ago, the following observation was made by respected academics, R. Stark & L. R. Iannaccone, regarding the prudent use of resources by Jehovah's Witnesses: 

"In 1992, the combined efforts of the Protestant churches of the United States and Canada sustained 41,142 overseas missionaries at a cost of more than $2 billion a year (Siewert & Kenyon, 1993). That same year, there were 3,279,270 “ overseas” Jehovah’s Witness publishers (nearly all of whom were native-speakers of the language of their mission area) operating on a total budget of $45 million (Yearbook, 1993: 33, 40). That is 80 times as many missionaries for a tiny fraction of the cost." (Journal of Contemporary Religion, Vol.12, No2, 1997).

Jehovah's Witnesses are quite happy to contribute both time and cost-covering money to furthering the interests of what they consider to be God's Kingdom at this time. And that includes direction on costs, along with information on cost-effective and efficient methods to make financial contributions to cover those costs.

So basically, Get over it! It is patently obvious that value for money when it comes to the activities of Jehovah's Witnesses is beyond criticism. Not beyond jealousy however, (Ez.38:11-12).

These other groups you mention appear to be covering far more than costs.

And who is paying the Victims of Child Abuse then ? Who paid the two million dollar (Supreme Court of California) court costs ? 

Who paid those two ex-brothers the hidden amounts for the abuse they suffered ?

Where oh where do you think all that money is coming from ? Remembering that this problem is now Earthwide. 

[JOHN BUTLER]

6 minutes ago, Gone Away said:

You're outa touch my baby, my poor old fashioned baby........

Not here in the UK I'm not. The congregations are only allowed to keep so much then have to hand over the rest. 

I only left the Org in the beginning of this year, so i do know what I'm talking about.

But of course you can try to belittle me as it's the thing JW's do. 

[Shiwiii]

4 minutes ago, Gone Away said:

Look, even the most basic comprehension of this topic demonstrates its pathetic reasoning. Covering costs is exactly what Jehovah's Witnesses are about, hence a per capita assessment, which makes perfect economic sense. You are presenting this (covertly) as if it were comparable to a levy, such as the tithing arrangement so favoured by some, or, as explicitly stated as a "passing the plate" excercise similar to that carried out customarily by others. I am not going to argue the case further on that point, but I would suggest a more careful marshalling of facts is really in order here.

So what you are saying is that its ok because it is the wt doing it for economic reasons and its not ok for other groups to do it for economic reasons. Gotcha.......sheesh. You're speaking out of both sides of your mouth. 

 

6 minutes ago, Gone Away said:

Jehovah's Witnesses are quite happy to contribute both time and cost-covering money to furthering the interests of what they consider to be God's Kingdom at this time. And that includes direction on costs, along with information on cost-effective and efficient methods to make financial contributions to cover those costs.

no problem at all from me about what jws want to do with their money and time. 

The problem I have is, the hypocritical stance of doing the same thing, but yet condemning others for the same practices. 

8 minutes ago, Gone Away said:

These other groups you mention appear to be covering far more than costs.

that is pure speculation, unless you have some reports of Hindu money practices. what isn't speculation is the numerous court cases that the wt is fighting across the world with your funds. I know you don't care about those issues nor that your money is being used in this way, but it is the facts. 

[Shiwiii]

1 minute ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Not here in the UK I'm not. The congregations are only allowed to keep so much then have to hand over the rest. 

I only left the Org in the beginning of this year, so i do know what I'm talking about.

But of course you can try to belittle me as it's the thing JW's do. 

you are correct John. 

Not only that but the continuous payment on building loans to wt headquarters after those loans have been paid back to the bank in full by the wt.  

[JOHN BUTLER]

1 minute ago, Shiwiii said:

you are correct John. 

Not only that but the continuous payment on building loans to wt headquarters after those loans have been paid back to the bank in full by the wt.  

So is it true that the JW Org is running out of money ? I do know they are selling Kingdom Halls here in the UK.

And the reduction in both magazines and book publications, inc Calendars and Day Texts.

Some might say it's because 'we are close to the end of this system' but I think it's because they are running out of money. 

[Shiwiii]

Just now, JOHN BUTLER said:

So is it true that the JW Org is running out of money ? I do know they are selling Kingdom Halls here in the UK.

And the reduction in both magazines and book publications, inc Calendars and Day Texts.

Some might say it's because 'we are close to the end of this system' but I think it's because they are running out of money. 

I think you are right, honestly. With the broadcast by mr. splaine, or it could have been mr lett, stating they had more going out then coming in, you just might be seeing the beginning  of the end......Armageddon of the wt.