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James Thomas Rook Jr.

....and like Forest Gump said "... and that's all I am going to say about that."

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40 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Goodby

Am I on Candid Camera?

40 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

 I am 73 years old, and I probably do not have time to change

Of course you do. Patch up with those kids first. Send them your above post as a letter of introduction, if you must. If you have all your children serving Jehovah, you have a better track record than me.

You likened yourself to Mickey once. Based on my limited knowledge of both, I can easily see a likeness.

“We made Miller Lite the #2 selling brand in the country, and everyone said ‘Nobody will drink that stuff.” Sometimes an actor switches roles.

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That was so sweet James!   Will send you this video a brother from New Zealand just sent.  But remember this scripture:

(Ephesians 4:23, 24) And you should continue to be made new in your dominant mental attitude, 24 and should put on the new personality that was created according to God’s will in true righteousness and loyalty.

You make changes daily and gradually.  It is not hard. You probably had to change your thinking in some way in order to write a nice post like that.  I endorse the two other posts above also.

I think you said things like that before.  But you are still here.  I am not saying 'Bye.  Listen to this lovely video.  Hope it plays!

 

 

IMG_25941.MOV

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9 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

when I have ranted and raved about all sorts of things, even from the Librarian, who often deleted my posts, with cause.

that old hen

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On 5/22/2020 at 12:36 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

 

In good times, and bad times, in times easy and times hard, I have relied on the JW-Archive as a sounding board for many things, and appreciate the forbearance when I have ranted and raved about all sorts of things, even from the Librarian, who often deleted my posts, with cause.

I have come to the conclusion that logic and reason is not the end-all that I had aspired to, and that all things being considered, it would have been better for me to be "Brother Watchtower", than the man I have become.

I am 73 years old, and I probably do not have time to change .... realistically, but for 14 billion years I did not exist, and I don't remember it bothering me any.

My Wife Susan, and my sons and daughter will fulfill whatever unfulfilled dreams I had, as the stars I could reach ... were just starfish on the beach.

With whatever time I have left, it is going to be my life's challenge, so I bid each of you so long, and hope you stay closer to Jehovah than I did. 

....and like Forest Gump said "... and that's all I am going to say about that."

Goodby.

 

I am truly saddened by this....I hope you are okay brother and you have been a great encouragement...because even tho you were obviously hurt with in the truth....you never lost your genuine love for your God Jehovah...and you underestimate your faith...faith is easy when it has not been beaten,,,,but to still have faith when you have been beaten and lay wounded.....that’s real faith...and it would be a honour to have served shoulder to shoulder with you.

I don’t know what’s going on..but I sincerely hope you are reasonably well....and a huge thank you from me....for being REAL !!!!!!

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2 hours ago, Thinking said:

for being REAL !!!!!!

Well, he certainly was that.

Offhand, I think you guys are nuts (not you specifically, Thinking) He lost all his kids—none will speak with him. And for what? So as to spread every opposition taunt and insult about the earthly organization that Witness and 4Jah and Srecko and Shiwiiiiiiiiiiiiiii and Matthew4 5784 are perfectly content and capable to spread? That is worth losing your family for?

I, for one, am delighted if he is recalibrating, because by doing so he may reasonably hope to reconcile himself to his family again, not to mention the greater brotherhood. Fear not, there is no danger of his becoming “Brother Watchtower,” as he put it. And, to be sure, I would prefer it if he continued with a modified parousia here rather than vanishing completely, for I will miss the guy. But sometimes in changing course one must make a complete break. I say that I am going to cease interacting with any of the villains, but then I come across that GIF of Kirk and the Gorn and it is curtains for me. Sometimes you just have to turn things off.

I both like and admire when someone is willing to call a spade a spade. But calling a heart, a diamond, and a club a spade as well is too much. Is he readjusting his life to become not so breathtakingly disrespectful of those struggling with their own imperfections to take the lead in the Christian work? Good. It is not such a horrible thing to allow oneself to be molded by discipline, particularly when it comes of his own accord, which it obviously did. 

ObiWan seemed to have disappeared. So did Gandalf. But they both came back much improved for their disappearance. Maybe the same here someday.

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@TrueTomHarley Likewise, in the debating community of which I am from, everyone (and their mother) will know if you left and or return, and whatever you say and or have done, is always in memory, be it something positive, negative, silly, thought provoking, etc. Granted said community, even me, we are as such and for good reason we remember these things, even mistakes that we've made, but a mistake doesn't result in a person to remain on the ground. For me case, an absurdly flabbergasted based response, I usually make a comment to, often times if I am too quick and or forgetful, I to can make a mistake.

That being said, all the things Rook said, I do not forget, I still recall the comments we made about "Unicorns" in the Bible and The Second Amendment.

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@TrueTomHarley  Should you be telling us about his personal life, or had he made it all public previously ? 

And should you be judging him and casting him in with us 'wicked ones' ?

As for judging us others (that you mentioned), maybe you have decided to dislike us for other reasons. For my part i think you misunderstand me / dislike me, because I'm not American.

I don't understand this part of JTR's comment :-

With whatever time I have left, it is going to be my life's challenge, so I bid each of you so long, and hope you stay closer to Jehovah than I did. 

But I think it was meant for those of you that knew him much better. 

The leaders of the Organisation are the cause of people not talking to each other. But sensible people bypass the Org and it's leaders and communicate anyway. 


 

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30 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

Should you be telling us about his personal life, or had he made it all public previously ? 

He made it all public previously.

30 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

And should you be judging him and casting him in with us 'wicked ones' ?

These are your words, not mine. I am not casting him anywhere. I am very glad to see he re-evaluating some choices he has made so that Nobody Else does.

30 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

I don't understand this part of JTR's comment :-With whatever time I have left, it is going to be my life's challenge, so I bid each of you so long, and hope you stay closer to Jehovah than I did. 

I do. He doesn’t buy into your claptrap that you can remain close to Jehovah while being at serious odds with his earthly organization. Thinking hit the nail on the head—he is REAL. If you are bringing your gift to the altar and you recall that your brother has something against you due to the outrageous things you have said, first make peace with your brother, and then offer up your gift. I imagine that this is what he is doing now.

9 hours ago, Thinking said:

a huge thank you from me....for being REAL !!!!!!

 

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@TrueTomHarley   He lost all his kids—none will speak with him. And for what? So as to spread every opposition taunt and insult about the earthly organization that Witness and 4Jah and Srecko and Shiwiiiiiiiiiiiiiii and Matthew4 5784 are perfectly content and capable to spread?  That is worth losing your family for?

You are a writer, and like many writers you write in riddles. But the gist of the above is that James spread every opposition taunt and insult about the earthly organization that Witness and 4Jah and Srecko and Shiwiiiiiiiiiiiiiii and Matthew4 5784 are perfectly content and capable to spread? 

James spoke truth. He didn't shy away from it. And if his children turned away from him for his speaking truth, then his children are at fault, not James. 

And if you are still so spiritually immature that you need to be 'bottle fed' by your GB, and if you are brainwashed into believing that the CCJW have God's approval, then you seriously have a problem for yourself. 

Its a good job the disciples didn't feel that they still needed to be bottle fed by the Scribes and the Pharisees after Jesus was no longer on Earth. After Jesus had been resurrected to heaven the disciples had no leader on earth. They relied on being guided from above, by Holy Spirit. 

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3 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

After Jesus had been resurrected to heaven the disciples had no leader on earth. They relied on being guided from above, by Holy Spirit. 

Actually, the head of the Church is still the Christ, therefore, Christ is still the leader of the Church despite not being on earth. The Bible tells us that he provided the keys to his followers and gave instruction on how to handle things, in turn, the church congregation of Christians were built up, as to be seen with the majority of 1st Century Christians after being given the gift to do the work, but the latter statement is indeed true.

Jesus was never gone for good, he is at the right hand of The Most High, Elohim, Yahweh. Although he has been made superior, as we read in Hebrews, that does not necessarily mean he is down for the count, especially the fact his command and instruction is to be done before God gives him the "OK" to make his return to gather his people.

The commission of the gospel is to be done without fail, and so thereafter, we know what is to come.

 

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Yes @Space Merchant I do realise that Jesus has all authority and power given to him and that he leads God's people by the use of Holy Spirit.  

The point i was making was that a person does not need to be guided by the CCJW or Watchtower or their GB.  I think in part you would agree with this ? You yourself are not a JW but you feel you have a close relationship with God through Christ. 

Mr Harley seems to feel that a person has to be a JW and work inline with that organisation to be able to serve God. 

@TrueTomHarley  I've noticed that you have changed your comment. :) 

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8 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Offhand, I think you guys are nuts (not you specifically, Thinking) He lost all his kids—none will speak with him. And for what? So as to spread every opposition taunt and insult about the earthly organization that Witness and 4Jah and Srecko and Shiwiiiiiiiiiiiiiii and Matthew4 5784 are perfectly content and capable to spread? That is worth losing your family for?

I don't know where to begin. :)   Firstly, he mentioned "reinstatement" here:  

When this actually happen, we don't really know.  He said above, "I have come to the conclusion that logic and reason is not the end-all that I had aspired to, and that all things being considered, it would have been better for me to be "Brother Watchtower", than the man I have become."  

Perhaps since this reinstatement, he cannot fully accept the organization that you believe he should accept,  because he sees hypocrisy.  Anyone who can perceives this, has a conscience.  

One JW here that I am certain you well respect, stated once that Christ transcends the organization.  If Christ does, so does God; which means that "Jehovah's organization" is not salvation.  You fit the term "Brother Watchtower" to the tee, since you cannot see this.  As much as I care for you also, I see your blindness toward scriptural truth.  

Secondly, I am finding that many JWs have this agenda to personally ridicule anyone who rejects "organization" and brings out solid facts as to why.  They are not rejecting God or Jesus.  Your response in this regard is to ridicule the person and not the information they may provided. You can call me anything that comes to your mind, Tom. (and you have)  But, it really doesn't give you any ammunition of worth, unless you bring scriptural facts of the contrary, to the fore.  

One more thing, since I have your attention:

Don’t assume that I came to bring peace on the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I came to turn

a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law;
36 and a man’s enemies will be
the members of his household.

37 The one who loves a father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; the one who loves a son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 And whoever doesn’t take up his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39 Anyone who finds his life will lose it, and anyone who loses his life because of me will find it.  Matt 10:34-39

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13 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Well, he certainly was that.

Offhand, I think you guys are nuts (not you specifically, Thinking) He lost all his kids—none will speak with him. And for what? So as to spread every opposition taunt and insult about the earthly organization that Witness and 4Jah and Srecko and Shiwiiiiiiiiiiiiiii and Matthew4 5784 are perfectly content and capable to spread? That is worth losing your family for?

I, for one, am delighted if he is recalibrating, because by doing so he may reasonably hope to reconcile himself to his family again, not to mention the greater brotherhood. Fear not, there is no danger of his becoming “Brother Watchtower,” as he put it. And, to be sure, I would prefer it if he continued with a modified parousia here rather than vanishing completely, for I will miss the guy. But sometimes in changing course one must make a complete break. I say that I am going to cease interacting with any of the villains, but then I come across that GIF of Kirk and the Gorn and it is curtains for me. Sometimes you just have to turn things off.

I both like and admire when someone is willing to call a spade a spade. But calling a heart, a diamond, and a club a spade as well is too much. Is he readjusting his life to become not so breathtakingly disrespectful of those struggling with their own imperfections to take the lead in the Christian work? Good. It is not such a horrible thing to allow oneself to be molded by discipline, particularly when it comes of his own accord, which it obviously did. 

ObiWan seemed to have disappeared. So did Gandalf. But they both came back much improved for their disappearance. Maybe the same here someday.

I feel nothing but sadness over this...I actually feel sick....I don’t know his past as most of you all do here..but I could see that obviously he had been hurt and badly disappointed in things he had witnessed and experienced or heard..that goes on InThe Org.

I hope sincerely  he does not become brother watchtower ....Because we don’t follow watchtower...no matter what others say....or try to infer on many of us here.
I believe he had a genuine heart.

I also hope he has left to do as you think he has ...and he isn’t dying !!!.
I would also like to point out what  Bro. David Splane  from the GB said at our Melbourne assembly
I can only paraphrase it from memory.

(There  are brothers and sisters who have been hurt with in the org....and we may have to allow them and put up with ...WILD TALK....from them...it’s part of their healing..).

He was mocked a lot and some down right cruel comments thrown his way ....I actually was surprised at how well he took it......I hope he comes back for selfish reasons...but for his sake....he would probably be safer and more content And remain faithful by going into his interior room until the denunciation has passed over.

 

 

 

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Quote ..Because we don’t follow watchtower...no matter what others say....or try to infer on many of us here.

That is so funny. No more than a month ago I was talking with an Elder on the telephone and I asked him about his view on something. His reply was that he would have to go and do some research on it. I wanted HIS viewpoint, not the Org's viewpoint, but i do know that JWs are told not to give their own personal viewpoint on anything relating to the Bible or the Org.  (been there, done that)

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People want so badly to be followers of men. “I don’t care what reasoning has been done or what counsel has been given. I want to know what you think.” 

Elders resist this because they are not trying to make their very own disciples. 

“For when one says, “I belong to Paul,” but another says, “I to A·polʹlos,” are you not acting like mere men? 5 What, then, is A·polʹlos? Yes, what is Paul? Ministers through whom you became believers, just as the Lord granted each one.  6 I planted, A·polʹlos watered, but God kept making it grow,  7 so that neither is the one who plants anything nor is the one who waters, but God who makes it grow.”

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Well well well. A 22lbs produce pack from the USDA. Apparantly all non-profits received a large supply to distribute. I’m very grateful. Elders distributed to the congregation members. But will this become a—gasp!— ‘Go to Donald’ type of thing?

Now I really miss JTR! I would love to hear his input here. But he is doing penance for “chattering about us with wicked words.” He’ll get that cleaned up, and be back soon, perhaps.

92763E8B-A4A2-4D7A-97B4-C728DEF0FE7B.jpeg

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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Elders resist this because they are not trying to make their very own disciples. 

I believe how more practical reason for such "resisting" would be in this: If you give advice to someone, you bear responsibility for content of advice if person implements it in own life situation and things go bad. 

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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Well well well. A 22lbs produce pack from the USDA. Apparantly all non-profits received a large supply to distribute. I’m very grateful. Elders distributed to the congregation members. But will this become a—gasp!— ‘Go to Donald’ type of thing?

HOW IT WORKS:

    Hello guest!

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1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I believe how more practical reason for such "resisting" would be in this: If you give advice to someone, you bear responsibility for content of advice if person implements it in own life situation and things go bad. 

Of course. Obviously. What!—you think it is right that Christians should be followers of men? I think you mutter just for the sake of muttering.

God’s laws and principles are to be found in the Bible. That is where the guidance and boundaries are. That is where members are to go so as to grow spiritually. The hope is that they should grow to maturity, make decisions per God’s laws and principles, and do not just say, “What do you think, Srecko, so I can think just like you?”

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So @TrueTomHarley never asks anyone's opinion of anything. Oh, hang on, he does actually, he asks the GB / CCJW / Watchtower opinion of everything by hanging on to their every word..  So that he can think like them. 

But Tom's opinion about Elders seems to be that they are robots programmed to only give GB viewpoints.

As one human being, i was asking another human being their point of view on a matter.  But Tom doesn't seem to like that idea. I think it frightens him. The idea of actually having a personal opinion is something foreign to Tom it seems. 

I wonder how the Governing Body work then ? If they are not allowed to ask other people's opinion. And Elders in a congregation. not allowed to ask other people's opinions. 

Quote "you think it is right that Christians should be followers of men?"

You are a followed of men Tom, you follow your GB and their helpers. 

Quote "God’s laws and principles are to be found in the Bible. That is where the guidance and boundaries are. That is where members are to go so as to grow spiritually."

Yes indeed, and people do go to God's word, and by doing so they prove to themselves that your GB / W/t teachings are wrong.  And one does not have to be a JW to do it either. 

Maybe you would like to discuss with @Space Merchant whether you need to be a JW to obtain guidance from God's word and to grow spiritually. 

Quote " The hope is that they should grow to maturity, make decisions per God’s laws and principles, "

But by CCJW standards those 'decisions made' have to be inline with the GB / JW Org. So basically the decisions are made for you. You see how you follow men. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, 4Jah2me said:

Maybe you would like to discuss with @Space Merchant whether you need to be a JW to obtain guidance from God's word and to grow spiritually. 

Learning correctly from the Scriptures is all that someone needs, especially you yourself, from what I can see. Once one understand God's Word, it does not stop there, they continue to progress and build up their faith in the profess. Regardless if someone is a JW, Biblical Unitarian, etc, they can learn too, it is not difficult. When one learn as such, they can develop spiritual growth with ease.

I'm only issue is conspiracy, falsehood and misconception. My biggest issue is Trinitarianism and the later manuscripts that commits to error in Scripture.

That being said, this just shows you assume things without knowing. I believe there is a lesson in the Bible for that, perhaps apply it, and maybe you too can take your own advice and medicine in regards to spiritual growth.

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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Of course. Obviously. What!—you think it is right that Christians should be followers of men? I think you mutter just for the sake of muttering.

God’s laws and principles are to be found in the Bible. That is where the guidance and boundaries are. That is where members are to go so as to grow spiritually. The hope is that they should grow to maturity, make decisions per God’s laws and principles, and do not just say, “What do you think, Srecko, so I can think just like you?”

What some fail to see is that Jesus gave instruction on how the church is to function. Even if you tell someone this a number of times, as is done on this forum on occasion, they forget very easily, for they do not truly read what is stated. Now, despite these instructions, the men Jesus entrusted, and later other men, were not perfect, therefore, early points in the church's history one can see what was went down, as is with church practices among the early Christians.

That is correct concerning God's Laws, however, some are a bit confused on God's Laws, and, I know Srecko loved this one, how it correlates with Biblical Facts. But yes, when we take up God's Laws and the principles found in Scripture and do well to apply them, we can grow spiritually, and our faith will be strong, but just as a muscle trained by body builders, as is with our faith, we do must continue to train it so it is always growing and staying strong, likewise, as with the Faithful Servant passage, spiritual food and milk is gain through that network as well.

That being said, I do not know how anyone can think as him, granted, I am still flabbergasted by the last decision with him regarding Ba'laam, even prior to my ministry tours with some folk, that notion was still absurd in all sense.

All in all, the core of it all is understanding God's Word, what it means, and how to apply it.

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Quote "That being said, this just shows you assume things without knowing."

@Space Merchant  I assumed that you are not a JW and that you have a close relationship with God through Christ. 

I also assumed that TTH believes that a person can only serve God through the CCJW 

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Quote @Space Merchant  "What some fail to see is that Jesus gave instruction on how the church is to function."

In the 1st Century there was one Christian religion, as it should still be, but it isn't. 

Now there are many different 'Christian' religions each with their own 'leaders'. 

If I'm right in my thinking, your religion is more tolerant of others, but the CCJW is not. 

You seem more tolerant of some other religions than JWs would be, because JWs are told there is only one way to serve God, and that is through the CCJW.  

 

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4 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Of course. Obviously. What!—you think it is right that Christians should be followers of men? I think you mutter just for the sake of muttering.

God’s laws and principles are to be found in the Bible. That is where the guidance and boundaries are. That is where members are to go so as to grow spiritually. The hope is that they should grow to maturity, make decisions per God’s laws and principles, and do not just say, “What do you think, Srecko, so I can think just like you?”

Why do you think that i was "attack" your thought about:  Elders resist this because they are not trying to make their very own disciples. 

I didn't. It is just fine if they have this positive attitude. Nevertheless, if they have to be role-models of faith, to be imitated from non-elders members, than it can be said how there is a "little danger" of following the men. Even in general positive matters.

Because, i guess how every individual need to build own relation to god, and by that specific, individualized, original, unique way to god's hearth and friendship. I used word "friendship" purposely, because WT publication "pushing" this sort of relationship between members and god as something that have to be established. Of course, it is interesting to understand how god is in position to chose his friend, not we. Even in Abraham situation, he become His friend not because Abraham chose god, but opposite, god chose him. Also, between so many faithful people in the past, who loved god till death, only for one human is reported as been god's friend. (Do not confuse with idea: JHVH was Abraham's friend) ??!! Something to think about, isn't it? :)))  

Well, if somebody have ambition to not "follow" other individuals and/or organization, and/or elders in that organization, he/she have to establish specific "relationship" or if you like "friendship" with ONLY one person, or at least two; Jesus and JHVH. Because Jesus is the name given to people to get close to JHVH. Here we see another WTJWorg omission. They speaking about "friendship"  with JHVH, but "forget" to put Jesus in the center of searching. Because Jesus is The Way to Father.

You said well, elders are not worth to be followed, neither GB and WTJWorg. Because that is what is all about.  :))

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16 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

 Also, between so many faithful people in the past, who loved god till death, only for one human is reported as been god's friend. (Do not confuse with idea: JHVH was Abraham's friend) ??!! Something to think about, isn't it? :)))  

Yes, it is interesting that only Abraham was "voiced" as God's  friend.  Yet, His expressions of love, especially for "Jacob"/Zion,  is stated all over the Bible.  Deut 7:6-9; 1 Kings 10:9; Ps 47:4

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33 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

Quote @Space Merchant  "What some fail to see is that Jesus gave instruction on how the church is to function."

In the 1st Century there was one Christian religion, as it should still be, but it isn't. 

We know of the 1st Century church, the point of which you missed is the instruction. Pay attention.

33 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

Now there are many different 'Christian' religions each with their own 'leaders'. 

And your point? The churches of old, likewise, as is with what happen 325AD and beyond.

33 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

If I'm right in my thinking, your religion is more tolerant of others, but the CCJW is not. 

Right in your thinking? I haven't see anything from you concerning Biblical Unitarianism. If so, give some insight because I see nothing of the sort from you.

33 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

You seem more tolerant of some other religions than JWs would be, because JWs are told there is only one way to serve God, and that is through the CCJW.  

It is not about tolerance. It is about cutting through conspiracy and misinformation, granted this forum was a controversial setting for speaking such things as is with church history.

I do the same with Islam, hence I destroy conspiracy with factual fact in said sense. As is with Judaism.

If you haven't notice, I study religion.

There IS one way to serve God, and as pointed out in the past, said path not many is aware of it, and or on that path, trying to get there.

 

42 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

Quote "That being said, this just shows you assume things without knowing."

@Space Merchant  I assumed that you are not a JW and that you have a close relationship with God through Christ. 

I also assumed that TTH believes that a person can only serve God through the CCJW 

And yet your other remark said otherwise. But this is true of you, your assumptions get the better of you, even when when the Bible speaks the truth.

 

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1 minute ago, Witness said:

Yes, it is interesting that only Abraham was "voiced" as God's  friend.  Yet, His expressions of love, especially for "Jacob"/Zion,  is stated all over the Bible.  Deut 7:6-9; 1 Kings 10:9; Ps 47:4

It is wise to understand as to why this was spoken of regarding Abraham. In Scripture this was noted several times. That is also true, but one should not be confusing both concepts.

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22 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Because Jesus is the name given to people to get close to JHVH. Here we see another WTJWorg omission. They speaking about "friendship"  with JHVH, but "forget" to put Jesus in the center of searching. Because Jesus is The Way to Father.

Sad, but true.  They forget, because they "follow" another way - through false christs and the organization/elder body.  The "center of searching" in this photo is certainly not the face of Christ.  

 

 

GB.jpg

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10 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

It is wise to understand as to why this was spoken of regarding Abraham.

It certainly is. 

10 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

In Scripture this was noted several times.

It certainly was.

10 minutes ago, Space Merchant said:

That is also true, but one should not be confusing both concepts.

I don't think anyone is.  

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22 minutes ago, Witness said:

I don't think any is.  

Both references and the the like shows for it, granted what makes it confusion is the interaction of Sheba to Solomon, especially her comments towards him, which is practically God blessing him, and the fact she saw that God was the mastermind behind Solomon's wisdom and prosperity, we also see that regarding Solomon, it is in accordance with the promise. Would it not have made sense to had cited Deuteronomy 4:5-7? It does make a bit more sense, especially if you were to pass the information to the learner, whom would read and take on the conclusion of the concept of a chosen people rather than the latter. As for Jacob, Deut. 9:5 and Deut. 7:6, would also make sense. I also forgot, Malachi 1:2 is another one, regarding Jacob, going with your statement that fits perfectly.

As for the first citation it is right as I said because the marginals I can see pointing to such, not to mention the notations that are at it's company.

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 Quote @Space Merchant I haven't see anything from you concerning Biblical Unitarianism. If so, give some insight because I see nothing of the sort from you.

What Do Biblical Unitarians Believe?
    Hello guest!
 

 

Please check out our website 
    Hello guest!
, which covers a variety of biblical topics and has an expanded Statement of Beliefs.

What is Our Relationship with The Body of Christ?

The Body of Christ is our family. Christians of every denomination are our brothers and sisters. We were each adopted into this family when we accepted Christ as our Lord. In Galatians 6:10, Christians are instructed to be “especially good to the household of faith,” and to do things particularly for “one another”—like bear one another’s burdens, be subject to one another, be devoted to one another, speak truth to one another, and love one another. We are also tasked with maintaining the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace. 

Is this any good for a starter ? 

 

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On 5/21/2020 at 9:06 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

 

In good times, and bad times, in times easy and times hard, I have relied on the JW-Archive as a sounding board for many things, and appreciate the forbearance when I have ranted and raved about all sorts of things, even from the Librarian, who often deleted my posts, with cause.

I have come to the conclusion that logic and reason is not the end-all that I had aspired to, and that all things being considered, it would have been better for me to be "Brother Watchtower", than the man I have become.

I am 73 years old, and I probably do not have time to change .... realistically, but for 14 billion years I did not exist, and I don't remember it bothering me any.

My Wife Susan, and my sons and daughter will fulfill whatever unfulfilled dreams I had, as the stars I could reach ... were just starfish on the beach.

With whatever time I have left, it is going to be my life's challenge, so I bid each of you so long, and hope you stay closer to Jehovah than I did. 

....and like Forest Gump said "... and that's all I am going to say about that."

Goodby.

 

Sounds like 'I've got cancer and got a few days to live, so you all have fun playing stress games, I'm gonna kick back  and relax and fall asleep, and come what may it comes. In your honor I would like to end our relationship with.....

 

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@4Jah2me Really..... Surely this is not the best you can do for I nearly mistook it as a joke, also this is the same thing John Butler pulled a while back, same with Screko, and somewhat of a worthy Christian history challenger - COS (who in turn set the wheels of debate and was the start of everything), So to you, 4Jah2me, close but no cigar. But the attempt..... Was quite elementary.

As with the very first statement ever made as I told Butler, I am a Biblical Unitarian, which is both fact and true, however, as pointed out, not ALL Unitarians are the same, for example, the notion of pre-existence and no belief in pre-existence  concerning Jesus (I suggest you check your link to that website, for you have a nasty habit of not looking at your sources clearly) and a list of other things such as textual criticism, excommunication, homosexuality, etc, more so, others, even the universal ones think otherwise. Reasons why I have mentioned that there are various forms of Unitarians, as pointed out in my first debate with Cos on this form regarding the history of the church and church fathers.

Moreover, as I also mentioned to Butler, I have an issue with INTERFAITH, even pointed out that some Unitarians are part of it, as for me, I am no part of Kairos, nor am I a part of the EII.

But I invite you, if you type in "interfaith" in the search, you will find most items pertaining to me:

image.png

 

Now, this below

4 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

Please check out our website 

    Hello guest!
, which covers a variety of biblical topics and has an expanded Statement of Beliefs.

And what are you trying to prove with this point? I do invite you to try however.

Moreover, the other bit is a bit odd. Which is contradicting because from my history here, I take issue with misconceptions and other things, I do not try to promote unity of all faiths despite their is some common ground concerning God and or the Christ. There are

Let this sink in, one of my remarks about interfaith among a dozen:

On 11/15/2018 at 4:18 PM, Space Merchant said:

I hold a strong disdain for Interfaith because I did the research and I observed, I know who is the real threat here, clearly you do not.

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1 hour ago, Matthew9969 said:

Sounds like 'I've [JTR] got cancer and got a few days to live,

Matt always did have an ingratiating way with words. At least Witness expressed some honest concern.

Should he not be welcomed back into the community? His posts are only slightly less nasty than what forced his leave at the end of the year.

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On 5/21/2020 at 11:06 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

My Wife Susan, and my sons and daughter will fulfill whatever unfulfilled dreams I had, as the stars I could reach ... were just starfish on the beach.

Just in case anyone wasn't aware, a few of JTR's recent posts had moved in this same direction, and I thought I'd share the entire song from which JTR referenced a couple of the lyrics. It struck me as too sad to respond immediately. Although I would not think it enough to draw any conclusions:

 

"Seasons In The Sun"
(originally by Jacques Brel)

Terry Jacks (performer)

Goodbye to you my trusted friend
We've known each other since we were nine or ten
Together we've climbed hills and trees
Learned of love and ABCs
Skinned our hearts and skinned our knees

Goodbye my friend, it's hard to die
When all the birds are singing in the sky
Now that the spring is in the air
Pretty girls are everywhere
Think of me and I'll be there

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the hills that we climbed
Were just seasons out of time

Goodbye papa, please pray for me
I was the black sheep of the family
You tried to teach me right from wrong
Too much wine and too much song
Wonder how I got along

Goodbye papa, it's hard to die
When all the birds are singing in the sky
Now that the spring is in the air
Little children everywhere
When you see them, I'll be there

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the wine and the song
Like the seasons, have all gone

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the wine and the song
Like the seasons, have all gone

Goodbye Michelle, my little one
You gave me love and helped me find the sun
And every time that I was down
You would always come around
And get my feet back on the ground

Goodbye Michelle, it's hard to die
When all the birds are singing in the sky
Now that the spring is in the air
With the flowers everywhere
I wish that we could both be there

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the stars we could reach
Were just starfish on the beach


We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the stars we could reach
Were just starfish on the beach


We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the wine and the song
Like the seasons, have all gone

All our lives we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the hills that we climbed
Were just seasons out of time

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
 

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20 minutes ago, JW Insider said:

We had seasons in the sun

Maybe I have a thing for sappy endings, but I like to think it is one of those things where If you seek Jehovah, even if you have gone off track, seek righteousness, and seek meekness, then probably it will turn out just fine in the end.

I trust it will work out that way and I count it a good thing, even if a temporary loss here.

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12 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Matt always did have an ingratiating way with words. At least Witness expressed some honest concern.

Should he not be welcomed back into the community? His posts are only slightly less nasty than what forced his leave at the end of the year.

Some of Rook's jokes are also humorous I also see his post not as binding to mixing things up. But yes, anyone is welcomed back, this goes for any forums or other media, but should things change, you'd have to adjust to these changes.

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No sooner had I posted this:

On 5/24/2020 at 8:19 AM, TrueTomHarley said:

Well well well. A 22lbs produce pack from the USDA. Apparantly all non-profits received a large supply to distribute. I’m very grateful. Elders distributed to the congregation members. But will this become a—gasp!— ‘Go to Donald’ type of thing?

than Witness posted this:

On 5/24/2020 at 9:39 AM, Witness said:

HOW IT WORKS:

    Hello guest!

It is a very helpful link explaining the program.

Now, Witness never ever posts things just to be helpful. In every case, she posts to denigrate her rivals the GB and to assure all that she can do things better. So why does she post this helpful link here?

Everyone knows her m.o. She is in a panic that God’s organization might get credit for this generosity and she wants to make sure that they don’t. She wants to make clear that this is a GOVERNMENT program, NOT a JehovahsWitness program, and that people SHOULD NOT credit her rivals with generosity. 

Chill, you old battle axe, don’t worry about it. I plainly said that it was a USDA program for which I was grateful. USDA is government. Relax. I wasn’t giving your rivals the credit. I even said it represented a “Go to Donald” and I lament that JTR was no longer around, for I suspected that might get him going. The only credit I gave to the elders was for distributing the items.

But does this prompt distribution not show the value of organization, organization that she says ‘Who needs it?’ Why does the USDA do it this way—distribute to non-profits? Because they have a ton of aid to distribute and if they do it all at government facilities the lines will be two miles long. They also face the challenge of letting potential recipients know. So they distribute to non-profits, taking advantage of the communication and distribution channels that they know will exist there.

Will everyone agree here that NOBODY will do this more effectively than Jehovah’s Witnesses? There may be some to do it AS effectively, but nobody will beat them at it. Organizations where all members are known and readily found and where there exist messengers to deliver foodstuffs to each and every one of them cannot be an everyday thing.

My wife and I received a package Saturday around 2PM, after hearing reports of such a program that morning. I can well imagine that there were churches whose members learned of it Sunday morning at services, assuming that they happened to be there, and if they weren’t—too bad. It is not my aim to put them down—frankly I think we do far too much of putting church people down—It is only to point out that the attention of the JW organization to each member is not replicated everywhere. Even where the will exists, the means may not—you have to have volunteers to quickly distribute. There will be some outfits, I have no doubt, that are attentive to those in need and will connect promptly to bring aid. But it will not be universal, and in some cases It will break down completely since it was never built up.

It’s produce. It can’t sit around for days. It has to be handed out to each individual promptly. Members of the Witness community are broken down into service meeting groups, each under the oversight of one or more shepherds, who will know of any among them who is especially needy, and can therefore be prioritized. Apparently, there was plenty for all this time, but that may not always be so, and the elders will know how to best apportion. They are prepared to organize internal relief as was done in the 2nd chapter of Acts—coordinate members sharing with members—so that nobody is overlooked. In this case, the aid came from outside—a provision of Caesar (probably not replicated in too many countries)—and all there was to do was to distribute it promptly. I am very grateful to the government that is attentive to physical needs. Nonetheless, much of it would fall flat without proper expedition.

And Witness says ‘Who needs organization?’ Is she nuts? This is why you need it. This is where, not only it is needed, but you draw yourself as close to it as possible so there will be no question that you are a part of it. You become one of the embers that knows enough to pull toward the main fire so as to remain embers. You don’t pull away from the fire so that, in time, nobody, including yourself, really knows it you are an ember or not.

“Be sure to tune in to the WomanfromtheHills broadcast at 2 PM on Facebook for a discussion which will be the same as last week’s discussion—how my rivals are doing it all wrong and I can do better. Oh—and are you physically hungry? I think there is a government center somewhere in your area where they are handing out food. Get in queue. The line is only two hours in the sun. It may be that you will get some produce before it wilts and you can still be back in time to hear my address on how the Great Eight are good for nothing.”

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TTH rabbits on worse that a squawking parrot. The Org does this the Org does that. Give it a rest Tom. 

Here in the UK we have 'Food Banks' making up food parcels and distributing to households. There is even a teacher that makes up 'school meal' parcels and delivers them to pupils homes. None of those people are JWs. 

There are probably millions of 'humanists' earthwide and here in UK  

    Hello guest!

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2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

She is in a panic that God’s organization might get credit for this generosity

Generosity?  True generosity would have been the opening of WT's money bags and allowing the congregation to help JWs as they see fit. Instead, they applied to be distributors of food provided for free, by the government.  Don't you see?  It wasn't generosity, but the organization's greedy act of protecting their OWN material interests.   (Matt 19:21; 2 Cor 9:9)

3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Will everyone agree here that NOBODY will do this more effectively than Jehovah’s Witnesses? There may be some to do it AS effectively, but nobody will beat them at it.

 

5 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

Here in the UK we have 'Food Banks' making up food parcels and distributing to households. There is even a teacher that makes up 'school meal' parcels and delivers them to pupils homes. None of those people are JWs. 

Food banks are all over the U.S., Tom.   They are nothing new and reach out to thousands on a regular basis, not just during a pandemic.  

 

3 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

And Witness says ‘Who needs organization?’ Is she nuts? This is why you need it. 

Is Jesus nuts?  I have been watching "The Chosen".  They are dramas taking place in Jesus' day.  As 4Jah2me had pointed out, they are not accurate as far as scripture goes, but they have a message.  Here is one for you.  LISTEN to what Jesus tells the woman at the well.  If you put your faith in "organization", in a "mountain", and not in the Spirit of God, you show you have little faith.  Zech 4:6,7

 

 

 

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@TrueTomHarley It is ironic because the very sighting of the 503 (c) again reminds me of how the latter said otherwise in the past.

But someone who gives food to those in need are capable, people who are unable to and or not doing it, it does not mean they are negative, but some would think otherwise, for I recall, Jesus instruction was the focus, although the other things are nice as well, but one should not go off from what is commanded, something of which people tend to forget about.

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On 5/24/2020 at 5:02 PM, 4Jah2me said:

Quote ..Because we don’t follow watchtower...no matter what others say....or try to infer on many of us here.

That is so funny. No more than a month ago I was talking with an Elder on the telephone and I asked him about his view on something. His reply was that he would have to go and do some research on it. I wanted HIS viewpoint, not the Org's viewpoint, but i do know that JWs are told not to give their own personal viewpoint on anything relating to the Bible or the Org.  (been there, done that)

You make me sick...you have shown your real core to everyone here....a man puts up what could be his eulogy to all..and you post up something to promote your belief...you try to score a point....you are ruthless and cruel..and so are some others here....you have shown the whole forum what condition  your heart is...How about showing a little common decency..and some respect....you disgust me as a human..
Unbelievable!!!

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22 hours ago, JW Insider said:

Just in case anyone wasn't aware, a few of JTR's recent posts had moved in this same direction, and I thought I'd share the entire song from which JTR referenced a couple of the lyrics. It struck me as too sad to respond immediately. Although I would not think it enough to draw any conclusions:

 

"Seasons In The Sun"
(originally by Jacques Brel)

Terry Jacks (performer)

Goodbye to you my trusted friend
We've known each other since we were nine or ten
Together we've climbed hills and trees
Learned of love and ABCs
Skinned our hearts and skinned our knees

Goodbye my friend, it's hard to die
When all the birds are singing in the sky
Now that the spring is in the air
Pretty girls are everywhere
Think of me and I'll be there

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the hills that we climbed
Were just seasons out of time

Goodbye papa, please pray for me
I was the black sheep of the family
You tried to teach me right from wrong
Too much wine and too much song
Wonder how I got along

Goodbye papa, it's hard to die
When all the birds are singing in the sky
Now that the spring is in the air
Little children everywhere
When you see them, I'll be there

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the wine and the song
Like the seasons, have all gone

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the wine and the song
Like the seasons, have all gone

Goodbye Michelle, my little one
You gave me love and helped me find the sun
And every time that I was down
You would always come around
And get my feet back on the ground

Goodbye Michelle, it's hard to die
When all the birds are singing in the sky
Now that the spring is in the air
With the flowers everywhere
I wish that we could both be there

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the stars we could reach
Were just starfish on the beach


We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the stars we could reach
Were just starfish on the beach


We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the wine and the song
Like the seasons, have all gone

All our lives we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
But the hills that we climbed
Were just seasons out of time

We had joy, we had fun
We had seasons in the sun
 

Yes I knew where he got that from and the point wasn’t missed...too sad...and I hope I’m wrong....dam ..I hope I’m wrong...

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3 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

But someone who gives food to those in need are capable, people who are unable to and or not doing it, it does not mean they are negative, but some would think otherwise,

Of course. The reason that you give money to a religious organization is that you believe in and want to further their work. You don’t give money thinking it is a rainy-day fund or an insurance policy. That’s what investments and insurance companies are for. Everyone knows this, even Witness. The reason she carries on as she does is that she does not like the religious work Witnesses do and would like to hinder it.

In fact, there is coordinated relief for disaster circumstances, but for the most part, it is Christians sharing with each other, same as was detailed a few times in the NT record—sometimes the organization facilitated or coordinated such relief.

This USDA program came into existence because crops are being wasted as restaurant supply lines are cut. Everyone in the US has heard such reports. So here is an effort to redirect foodstuffs and nonprofits help them realize their goal of distribution. On balance, Jehovah’s Witnesses contribute to the public till more than most—they don’t try to evade responsibilities—while drawing on it less. They certainly are a suitable candidate for the program.

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@TrueTomHarley Yes. I have often seen in other communities that if they do not make a school, a hospital and or the like then they are "Not of God" or "Not of Christ". Many people seem to be missing the point of what it means to be of God and his Christ.

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