Piñatas

[Guest Nicole]

Why are JW's not allowed to use piñatas at parties? 

[Simplicity]

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102003687 Please see the attached article of the September 22, 2003 Awake.

[Guest Nicole]

Thanks for your response, I read that article but I still have that same question. Interestingly someone asked Awake a similar question. Can anyone explain it clearer? 

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102004486?q=piñata&p=par

Piñatas I read with interest the article “The Piñata—An Ancient Tradition.” (September 22, 2003) It left me with some questions. The ties to false religion are well-documented. But the article seemed to take the position that as long as it doesn’t bother someone’s conscience, it is OK. What about birthdays and holidays such as Christmas?

S. W., United States

“Awake!” responds: Christians refrain from any celebrations or customs that continue to involve false religious beliefs or activities that violate Bible principles. For example, the Bible definitely puts birthday celebrations in a bad light. (Genesis 40:20; Matthew 14:6-10) However, if it is very obvious that a custom has no current false religious significance and involves no violation of Bible principles, each Christian must make a personal decision as to whether he will follow such a custom.

[Shiwiii]

Taken from the article:

"A main concern is, not what the practice meant hundreds of years ago, but how it is viewed today in your area. "

 

Really?!?

Then why are birthdays bad again? oh yeah, the beheading thing right? Both instances in the Bible given in the articles speak of someone being beheaded, so they MUST be bad. Well then Mothers should NOT be giving their children naps!!!!!!! The practice of taking naps in the afternoon is tied with beheading as well!          see below

How utterly ridiculous it is to deny a child the fun surrounding their birthday. Its ONE day of the year. Don't give me that BS "we can celebrate a child any day of the year, not just one day" That is a lame excuse to force conformity. Is that why "turkey day" is a day around thanksgiving? OR "present day" is near Christmas?  or a costume party in early November is ok?                                                                                       

2 Samuel 4:5-7

"5 And the sons of Rimmon the Beerothite, Rechab and Baanah, went, and came about the heat of the day to the house of Ishbosheth, who lay on a bed at noon.

6 And they came thither into the midst of the house, as though they would have fetched wheat; and they smote him under the fifth rib: and Rechab and Baanah his brother escaped.

7 For when they came into the house, he lay on his bed in his bedchamber, and they smote him, and slew him, and beheaded him, and took his head, and gat them away through the plain all night."

 

 

[Evacuated]

17 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

to deny a child the fun surrounding their birthday

Typical half-baked argument. The so-called "birthday fun", no matter how twee, is imposed upon children by adults.

Children would not attach any significance to birthdays, if they even remembered them, without this practice being continually reinforced by doting adults often under the influence of commercial and media propoganda.

To say that children are then "denied fun" is like a drug dealer complaining that prohibition is denying his clients fun from using a substance he has addicted them to for his own personal gain.

Try another tack on this please!

[Shiwiii]

6 hours ago, Eoin Joyce said:

Typical half-baked argument. The so-called "birthday fun", no matter how twee, is imposed upon children by adults.

Children would not attach any significance to birthdays, if they even remembered them, without this practice being continually reinforced by doting adults often under the influence of commercial and media propoganda.

To say that children are then "denied fun" is like a drug dealer complaining that prohibition is denying his clients fun from using a substance he has addicted them to for his own personal gain.

Try another tack on this please!

So instead of taking my comment as a whole, you choose the easiest portion to argue against.

Try addressing the notion that the society sees birthdays as a practice that God dislikes based upon the two instances given in the Bible to support their claim and the point which I have also addressed. So drawing from the society's line of reasoning, naps must also displease God. Is that a true statement? Does God dislike naps? Why? Why not? Using the same logic I would have to think that the society does believe that God dislikes naps....and cats too, but we won't go there just yet. 

[Evacuated]

7 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

you choose the easiest portion to argue against

If it falls down here, there is little point in arguing on any other basis. No need to sledgehammer this little nut.

[TrueTomHarley]

8 hours ago, Shiwiii said:

So instead of taking my comment as a whole, you choose the easiest portion to argue against.

Who doesn't?

Besides, you know full well that beheading is no more than an auxiliary point, nowhere presented as the main reason. These days (thankfully) it recedes even more as a factor when the subject is discussed.

(just in case you are on to something, though, I haven't taken a nap since I read your words)

[Shiwiii]

16 hours ago, Eoin Joyce said:

If it falls down here, there is little point in arguing on any other basis. No need to sledgehammer this little nut.

I disagree, Its more so because defending the syllogism fallacy used to support the control of people for harmless practices  is impossible, so one must take a diversion as to avoid the obvious. 

[Shiwiii]

15 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Who doesn't?

Besides, you know full well that beheading is no more than an auxiliary point, nowhere presented as the main reason. These days (thankfully) it recedes even more as a factor when the subject is discussed.

(just in case you are on to something, though, I haven't taken a nap since I read your words)

I'm interested in your point of the beheading being auxiliary. If that is not the major support then what is? Isn't it the beheading that is painting "birthdays" in the Bible in a bad light? 

From the reasoning book:

Definition: The day of one’s birth or the anniversary of that day. In some places the anniversary of one’s birth, especially that of a child, is celebrated with a party and the giving of gifts. Not a Biblical practice.

Do Bible references to birthday celebrations put them in a favorable light? The Bible makes only two references to such celebrations:

Gen. 40:20-22: “Now on the third day it turned out to be Pharaoh’s birthday, and he proceeded to make a feast . . . Accordingly he returned the chief of the cupbearers to his post of cupbearer . . . But the chief of the bakers he hung up.”

Matt. 14:6-10: “When Herod’s birthday was being celebrated the daughter of Herodias danced at it and pleased Herod so much that he promised with an oath to give her whatever she asked. Then she, under her mother’s coaching, said: ‘Give me here upon a platter the head of John the Baptist.’ . . . He sent and had John beheaded in the prison.”

Everything that is in the Bible is there for a reason. (2 Tim. 3:16, 17) Jehovah’s Witnesses take note that God’s Word reports unfavorably about birthday celebrations and so shun these.

Nothing in scripture states that the celebration of a birthday is prohibited. 

[Nnaemeka]

You missed two points from what you read in the reasoning book. 

1. 2 Timothy 3:16,17 was quoted. It emphasizes the fact that what were written in the scriptures was to equip Christians to please Jehovah. 

Quote

17 so that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.

The examples of birthdays in the bible were bad examples and not worthy for Christians to emulate.

Then comes the second reason you decided to miss out. 

2. Secular history. The Jews and early Christians associated birthday with idolatry. Why did you not realize that, Shiwii? The Jews wouldn't celebrate birthdays and when they read pharah's account and Herod's beheading of John they see it as a scriptural confirmation of what they are already aware of. Bad examples. Romans 15:4a comes to mind here:

Quote

4 For all the things that were written beforehand were written for our instruction,

As Christians we copy good examples.

[TrueTomHarley]

1 hour ago, Shiwiii said:

I'm interested in your point of the beheading being auxiliary. If that is not the major support then what is? 

Search for more recent materials explaining birthdays. They play down the beheading references, which were possibly overused.