TOP STORY TODAY: DETAILS TO FOLLOW …..

[Pudgy]

50 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

So … You just admitted trying to obfuscate the issue 8 times …

Now it’s nine times! 

I present for your consideration the following:

1.) NINE TIMES you tried to divert from having to post the scripture YOU PROVIDED in context, to refute my viewpoint, and,

2.) The Brother who was not allowed to marry at a Kingdom Hall who committed suicide had his funeral at a Kingdom Hall, and if he had murdered anyone, as Snowflakes extrapolate, his funeral at the KH WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN PERMITTED if he had, and, 

3.) The TWO Biblical examples of those did kill themselves were never disparaged in any way by God or Jew for doing so, and, 

4.) It was common practice for Jews about to be captured by cruel enemies to suicide …. Ever read about the Roman siege of the mountain top Jewish fortress of Masada? About 900 Jews in one night suicided rather than be captured, and finally,

5.) NOWHERE IN THE BIBLE is suicide forbidden or even disparaged.

….. go fitch!

 

So, you think the five enumerated points above are “… nonsense as usual”?

Since you would not post that scripture YOU SUPPLIED in context, and by your own admission refused to do so 8 times and more, and refused to discuss the five enumerated points above, I posit the ONLY way to have an “educated Bible discussion” with you is have a Prefrontal Lobotomy, and agree with your unscriptural goofy tradition  based and irrational thinking.

[Moise Racette]

To the visitors. There is plenty of evidence with either biblical backing or human laws, which determine and classify KILL, MURDER, and SUICIDE. With respect to human laws, depending on the governments, most institutions consider suicide as self-murder. Some dictionaries classify it as such.

In both instances, the message is clear.

Biblically speaking, ALL murder is an act against another and is NOT tolerated by God, regardless of what humanity thinks.

 Noun kill - /kɪl/

2 The act of terminating a life

Thesaurus

Hyponym: annihilate asphyxiate asphyxiation assassinate behead beheading brain bump off butcher cack carry off commit suicide coup de grace death deathblow decapitate decapitation decimate decollate despatch destroy dismember dispatch do in draw draw and quarter drown electrocute electrocution eliminate eradicate erase euthanasia execute exsanguinate exterminate extinguish fell fry genocide hit homicide impale kill off knock off lapidate liquidate lynch martyr massacre mercy killing mow down murder neutralise neutralize off overlay overlie pip poison poisoning polish off put away put down put to death put to sleep quarter race murder racial extermination remove ritual killing saber sabre sacrifice self-annihilation self-destruction shed blood shoot slaughter slay smother stake stone strangle strangulate strike down suffocate suffocation suicide take off throttle tomahawk vaporize waste wipe out zap

 

Noun murder - /mˈɜɹdəɹ/ 1 Unlawful premeditated killing of a human being by a human being

2 To kill intentionally and with premeditation

Thesaurus

Synonym: bump off dispatch execution hit mangle mutilate off polish off remove slay slaying

Hypernym: distort falsify garble homicide kill warp

Hyponym: assassination bloodshed burke butchery carnage contract killing dry-gulching elimination execute filicide fratricide gore hit infanticide liquidation lynching mariticide mass murder massacre parricide prolicide regicide shoot-down slaughter thuggee tyrannicide uxoricide viricide

Derived: murdered murderer murdering murderous murders

 

Noun suicide - /sˈuəsaɪd/ 1 The act of killing yourself It is a crime to commit suicide 2 A person who kills himself intentionally

Thesaurus

Hypernym: kill killer killing putting to death slayer

Ex. 20:13 ¶ ^p“You shall not murder.³

 Matt. 5:21 ¶ ^y“You have heard that it was said to those of old, ^z‘You shall not murder; and whoever murders will be liable ^ato judgment.’

 Matt. 19:18 He said to him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said, ^m“You shall not murder, You shall not commit adultery, You shall not steal, You shall not bear false witness,

 Rom. 13:9 For the commandments, ^y“You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet,” and any other commandment, are summed up in this word: ^z“You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”

James 2:11 For he who said, ^l“Do not commit adultery,” also said, ^l“Do not murder.” If you do not commit adultery but do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law.

 Mark 10:19 You know the commandments: ^x‘Do not murder, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and mother.’”

 Luke 18:20 You know the commandments: ^w‘Do not commit adultery, Do not murder, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honor your father and mother.’”

There is wisdom in the words of Matthew 15:14. What defiles a man

14 Disregard them! They are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.

[Pudgy]

Notice Dear Reader (hahaHAHhaha) that Poindexter did not address ANY of my enumerated points … and only advocated traditional simplistic extrapolations of similar thoughts, and word salad irrelevancies.

People shoes, and Brake shoes are not the same thing …. Even for Fred Flintstone.

[Moise Racette]

Denial! Denial! Denial like a common disfellowshiped wimp!! Yet, the poster can't defend what is the truth. An uneducated clown never can. 😅 😅

[Pudgy]

The incompetent ALWAYS resort to ad hominem attacks when their arguments fail miserably.

30 minutes ago, Moise Racette said:

Denial! Denial! Denial like a common disfellowshiped wimp!! Yet, the poster can't defend what is the truth. An uneducated clown never can. 😅 😅

 

[Space Merchant]

19 hours ago, Witness said:

No, I don't know this person "well" except for listening to a few of his videos. 

When you listen, you have to understand that his word vs the police report do not line up at all. Even as a Christian, people should not fall for anything that is clearly misleading. A lot of people are guilty of this, and are often duped by some misleading information, be it from persons or a news source, ironically, even some JWs are guilty of this too.

19 hours ago, Witness said:

You have a lot of,  well  some, good qualities that I personally can detect, SM; but I will say this again, you don't know what it's like to be a JW, you have no clue what living that life is all about.

Culturally, we my people, even outside of faith, are suppose to be good and abstain from dishonorable conduct and action, being of faith simply amplifies that.

Witness, this was said again, you do not have to be among Jehovah's Witnesses to realize that you are being lied to by former members. In addition to that, I have an idea, so much so, in my absence since my last responses to you regarding archives, within 300 days, I met many, many people, members of other faiths, did my usually debates with those who adhere to the Trinity, as is help and comfort children, in addition to that, I met nearly over 60 JWs around the state, some of them, I did challenge on how to result some issues at a grounded level, something you or any EXJW for some reason refrain from doing. I have met even EXJWs and challenged them on facts, and they stuck to falsehood, among said challenges was regarding ARC and actual pedophiles among EXJWs themselves who I deduce as Opportunists (thanks to the aid of groups who fight CSA by seeking molesters out.)

Also how are you able to personally detect one's cultural aspect? That is impossible to do so, being a normal imperfect human of course. We do not know each other so knowing this personally, is a false assessment, as is unverified.

19 hours ago, Witness said:

You certainly have no basis to say that the man was telling a falsehood about what he witnessed during his time in Bethel. 

Unfortunately, I am in that realm to call out falsehoods when I see it. The man in question, Marcus is no different from Rick Fearon and others. In this case the Thornton Police Report differs completely from what this Ex-Bethlite is attesting to. To make matters worse, he is telling his audience that this was the fault of Jehovah's Witnesses 100% when in reality it is the other way around.

Going by the police over this Ex-Bethlite, the police report attesting to the fact this man was already deem problematic, to his former employers and his former faith, perhaps this was the very reason Enoch was kicked out via Excommunication by means of the Jehovah's Witnesses. Surely, if you were either any of the JWs or employer, if a man threats to end your life and anyone around you, you'd not want him sticking around long, now do you? Ironically, the Ex-Bethlite did NOT address this although this was in the report.

 

The note was already addressed: Just over a year before the explosions and shooting, a representative of Apodaca's former employer said that he had told a Local 68 union representative that he would shoot his wife and the union representative after he and his wife lost their jobs...

Marcus did not even say this to his EXJW audience, which includes you.

Marcus also addressed that these people had 0 contact with any member of the Jehovah's Witnesses, but this is false because in the report, if you actually read it, Enoch was the one who actually spoke with someone of the faith. Marcus also tried to throw the Apodaca Family into this mess to try and refute Excommunication practices of the faith. It is already said by some if they were still among JWs or had access to more of that faith, the death toll would be higher.

I remember saying the EXJWs have an agenda, this is a prime example of this notion.

As another note, we had a situation sometime ago, the Keego Harbor mom to murder-suicide in which even EXJWs spun this story, some like Marcus, who did this. some even attested to the fact the Jehovah's Witnesses themselves provided this woman the gun, which is false, not to mention the couple in this case willfully left the faith themselves.

19 hours ago, Witness said:

You are either highly naive, or highly arrogant in your assumptions.

You're defending falsehood. The truth is in the Thornton Police Department Report itself, something of which the Ex-Bethlite did NOT address because it does not fit, his agenda. It should be noted to that area in the United States is prone with violence for some time now, including the situation in question.

That being said, you tell us time and time again you are Christian, but you as a Christian should realize you are defending falsehood when the facts is present. In this case I need not be strict because from what has transpired, seems as though your base is dying out.

 

It is also a bit of hypocrisy, granted, EXJWs seek to use the genuine police officers for any wrongdoing, but when the police says something, somehow it is no believable.

 

You truly need to wake up, can;t be sleeping as a member of Christ's church.

[Space Merchant]

22 hours ago, Moise Racette said:

A mentally unstable person that wants to blame something on others instead of their own failures in life will go through extreme judgment on those people he/she has targeted. In this case, he made the Org the target to tarnish and discredit.

This Marcus guy is known among the EXJWs to spin stories, mixing truths with half truths. What is far more bewildering is his take on background checks, which does not always work but he thinks it is absolute, as is his take on the Constitution. Not to mention, tragically, this is the same person who defended Russia's action on Jehovah's Witnesses.

The only good thing is when anyone with a rational mind listens to his videos and align the facts next to it, the facts will win out 100% of the time. This Marcus guy is trying to use the situation to his advantage, as is his agenda which mirrors with the remaining small batch of EXJWs in existence.

As we speak, there is another community, ironically EXJWs who has no beef with JWs who, although agreeing and disagreeing with some notions of their former faith, they are strong and quick to shut down any false information provided by persons like Witness or similar. I only learned of this community from one former JW who since left the so called apostate army because of the death threats some people made against JWs, one threat including a hunt, entrap and gas type of threat which mirrors that of Nazis did to the Jews; which was his final straw in leading the disgruntled EXJWs.

22 hours ago, Moise Racette said:

This will be unknown, since there are circumstances that a wife agrees with the husband's suicide pact, or vice versa.

So, who knows what was in her mind. The fact she was there speaks volumes.

https://nypost.com/2023/01/23/ellen-gilland-76-killed-sick-husband-as-part-of-suicide-pact-cops/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27643706/

Indeed. But even the possibly of wanting to commit harm but not dying can be another factor. If there was some note or letter of some kind left behind, it would have given us an idea.

22 hours ago, Moise Racette said:

Another reason why that person showed not repentance or remorse. Unwillingness to remove himself from his old self. There are biblical reasons why God's church needs to be kept clean, from unrepentant souls. His actions proved it.

Yes, even outside of faith the fact this person threatened people he worked with falls in line with Workplace Violence, for such threats can be the catalyst to get someone kicked out, especially if someone is agreeing to said threats.

There was an internal situation in one of the investor banks, will not say the name, but there was a contractor back in 2019 who threat to end the lives of other contractors and security officials, this took place within their warehouse. Not only this person was kicked out, he was blacklisted from ever working in a similar investor bank again. Just as a church or a community seeks to do its best to keep things clean, as is with other institutions. But this Ex-Bethlite thinks such action is isolated to JWs alone.

[Moise Racette]

4 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

This Marcus guy is known among the EXJWs to spin stories, mixing truths with half truths. What is far more bewildering is his take on background checks, which does not always work but he thinks it is absolute, as is his take on the Constitution. Not to mention, tragically, this is the same person who defended Russia's action on Jehovah's Witnesses.

I find those that subject themselves to false narratives comical. 

4 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

Indeed. But even the possibly of wanting to commit harm but not dying can be another factor. If there was some note or letter of some kind left behind, it would have given us an idea.

If a person is unwilling, that person will make every attempt to make it known. I have gone through that scenario. It doesn't matter how unwilling the partner is, they will find a way. 

In this case, there doesn't seem to be any indication of that unwillingness. Therefore, I would label it Bonnie and Clyde.

4 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

Yes, even outside of faith the fact this person threatened people he worked with falls in line with Workplace Violence, for such threats can be the catalyst to get someone kicked out, especially if someone is agreeing to said threats.

Indeed. There are many institutions that don't allow many kinds of behavior. The Salvation Army won't allow drunks in their safe houses. Outsiders in Mexico "SHUN" their relatives for being gay, etc.

Yet, these 2 apostates here want that for the Org like dictators.

[Space Merchant]

@Moise Racette Sadly, they'll continue to dwell on their own delusion. As long as the Police Report exists, the hearsay will not get far expect remain confined to their own isolated community. The good thing is the Thornton community is aware of what is true, so much so, some of them are combatting EXJW misinformation, like the screenshot provided, I have several more of these as well.

The Thornton police however, had a rough few weeks, and this situation was not even the worse of it for them.

That being said, the question addressed I already know it won't be answered by Witness, reasons being you have The Police report vs the Ex-Bethlite, only one is correct and the other is wrong. All followers of Christ should be sticking to what is true, but this is an example of willfully following of deception, an alleged Firstfruit no less to be doing this. That is a problem.

[Moise Racette]

2 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

That being said, the question addressed I already know it won't be answered by Witness, reasons being you have The Police report vs the Ex-Bethlite, only one is correct and the other is wrong. All followers of Christ should be sticking to what is true, but this is an example of willfully following of deception, an alleged Firstfruit no less to be doing this. That is a problem.

True, that is why I have friends in Colorado that give firsthand information.

[Matthew9969]

On 1/28/2023 at 9:48 PM, Pudgy said:

4.) It was common practice for Jews about to be captured by cruel enemies to suicide …. Ever read about the Roman siege of the mountain top Jewish fortress of Masada? About 900 Jews in one night suicided rather than be captured, and finally,

I actually got to climb Masada, it was a surreal experience.

[Space Merchant]

And here goes another one, someone brought up this one in another community, another shooting, with Jehovah's Witnesses involved, as targets. the case in of itself is interesting because it seems like the shooter is a 15 year old teenager - Police identified the suspect as a 15-year-old boy, whose name was not released by police. The boy is not in custody, according to police. Rockford isn't much of a high crime areas compared to the other shooting on Christmas day.