Dear Librarian I have a JW neighbour who lets his dog to go out without any supervision. For what I see this dog goes in the streets looking for food. He must not feed him.Isn't this animal cruelty? How he can pretend to be a ministerial servant if he is

[Pudgy]

..... sometimes not raising a cow well,  ... the  *coff*  ... steaks are too high.

[JW Insider]

On 10/24/2021 at 6:49 PM, Pudgy said:

I personally prefer to think of eggs as boneless chicken.

Way back in school days we used to make up fake Greek & Latin names for things, just to kill time (i.e., chronocide)

• scrambled eggs = poultrus cluckus abortus

Evidently, Monty Python had some fun with the same idea in "Life of Brian."

[TrueTomHarley]

Sigh….though it has nothing to do with anything in the thread, out of left field comes this gem from PSomH:

22 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

How can you be concerned about a dog, but not concerned about Child Sexual Abuse in the JW Org ? 

“Neither the search nor the investigation produced any evidence that the Belgian Jehovah’s Witnesses had ever protected members accused of sexual abuse of minors by not reporting them to the police in violation of the Belgian rule of mandatory reporting.

“….The Court of Brussels has now concluded that “there is no evidence” that the Jehovah’s Witnesses in Belgium violated the reporting obligation... Scholars of new religious movements have repeatedly warned that accusations by disgruntled former members should of course be examined, but cannot be considered like established facts, and their attitudes and motivations should also be considered.”

https://bitterwinter.org/jehovahs-witnesses-win-important-case-in-belgium/

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@TrueTomHarley and your point is ? 

JWs here in the UK are not getting tortured or locked in prison. That doesn't mean JWs here in the UK are not concerned about JWs in Russia or elsewhere.

So, on that same principle, JWs in any country should be concerned about Child Sexual Abuse in the whole of the Watchtower / JW Org Earth wide. 

Are you therefore suggesting that JWs in one country should show no interest in the JW activity in another country ? 

And I note that the good old GB and Co, sued the Belgium Ministry of Justice ( outcome to follow )

On June 18, 2021, the Belgian Jehovah’s Witnesses sued the Belgian Ministry of Justice, considering it responsible for the CIAOSN, for defamation. A hearing on the defamation claim is scheduled for May 5, 2022.

Whereas Jesus wasn't concerned about being 'counted amongst lawless ones' 

Luke 22 : 37

For I tell you that what is written must be accomplished in me, namely, ‘He was counted with lawless ones.’ For this is being fulfilled concerning me.”

The GB and it's many Orgs act in complete opposition to Jesus Christ. 

And my point still stands as true :-

How can you be concerned about a dog, but not concerned about Child Sexual Abuse in the JW Org ? 

[Space Merchant]

9 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

JWs here in the UK are not getting tortured or locked in prison. That doesn't mean JWs here in the UK are not concerned about JWs in Russia or elsewhere.

Yes and no, as I was clear of the events that transpired out of Hyde Park, which also effected JWs. There is a bit of torment and harassment that has been taking place in the United Kingdom concerning religious folks, even JWs, i.e. a situation with influence from various disgruntled JW members which led to some unfortunate members of the faith to be at the wrong place at the wrong time. More so a version of harassments comes in form of those who are Pro-Agenda, who take their actions out on a victim that is Anti-Agenda.

 

9 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

So, on that same principle, JWs in any country should be concerned about Child Sexual Abuse in the whole of the Watchtower / JW Org Earth wide. 

They are, the ones who recognize CSA, and the one JW who lives in the same zone are you are, is quite vocal about it, the only difference is no one listens to him not because he is a JW, but because he is an Arab, hence Anti-Arabism, this is also in connection with influence spread in the media, as is, the events with Tommy Robinson.

That being said, as for the United Kingdom, the majority, you included, may not know about what your own government, as is the laws of said land, has been used to shield those of status, such as IICSA's Teresa May.

What it comes down to is the people taking action, but it seems as although Truthers were right in regards to some people when it comes to CSA; for no grounded discussion, equates to even more CSA, and the fact that the UK is going the same route as Canada and Australia, CSA is going to a big problem in the coming months. For it is said, once Authoritarianism takes full effect, there will be those who seek out children for ill desire that will run rampant, perhaps even closer to home, in your case.

Other than that, in regards to CSA, that could have been brought up in the other thread, not here since we are talking about dogs and domestic animals, for if we have to go down that route, I would be happy to reveal not just the US, but what the UK has done to animals, some things, of which, to hellish to speak of.

[Space Merchant]

13 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Sigh….though it has nothing to do with anything in the thread, out of left field comes this gem from PSomH:

“Neither the search nor the investigation produced any evidence that the Belgian Jehovah’s Witnesses had ever protected members accused of sexual abuse of minors by not reporting them to the police in violation of the Belgian rule of mandatory reporting.

“….The Court of Brussels has now concluded that “there is no evidence” that the Jehovah’s Witnesses in Belgium violated the reporting obligation... Scholars of new religious movements have repeatedly warned that accusations by disgruntled former members should of course be examined, but cannot be considered like established facts, and their attitudes and motivations should also be considered.”

https://bitterwinter.org/jehovahs-witnesses-win-important-case-in-belgium/

Yes, this is known, however, I don't see how we went from dogs, cows and chickens to child sex abuse, once again, which proves the case made a while back.

Other then that, in regards to animals, the US as well as the UK has done wild things to animals, what is sickening is that some people with ill intent have creative and destructive minds on committing harm on animals. So much so that the Animal welfare groups take a lot of action when cases are on the rise for such things.

[TrueTomHarley]

12 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

in regards to animals, the US as well as the UK has done wild things to animals, what is sickening is that some people with ill intent have creative and destructive minds on committing harm on animals.

Nothing will get a decent person infuriated more than animal abuse. Maybe it’s quasi-instinctive. Our commission specifically is to care for all thing of the earth, have it in subjection. In animal abuse lies the most blatant trashing of that commission. 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

On 10/26/2021 at 1:27 AM, TrueTomHarley said:

Nothing will get a decent person infuriated more than animal abuse.

So then I must be an indecent person as I get more infuriated by CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE. 

Think of me as you will, I feel more for humans than I do for animals. And I feel more sympathy for children than adults. 

[Space Merchant]

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

So then I must be an indecent person as I get more infuriated by CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE. 

Then keep that same energy. If you can leave JWs for CSA, then you can do the same for Facebook and related media, granted, a crazy recent event in regards to CSA in the realm of social media, as is the people allegedly being let go only to commit more acts, far worse than last, if that is what you are conveying here.

That being said, in regards to CSA, I don't see how you continue to use said media, knowing what is hidden there as well, mainly when it comes to UK social media. - in the UK alone more than 5k children were groomed, on the other side of the spectrum, some have be involved in violent, sex related crimes and or moved to commit crime. Again, abusers are cunning when it comes to targeting children, mainly those who are willing to run off with strangers.

It gives reason to those in the UK who blame all who live in it for these acts.

23 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Nothing will get a decent person infuriated more than animal abuse. Maybe it’s quasi-instinctive. Our commission specifically is to care for all thing of the earth, have it in subjection. In animal abuse lies the most blatant trashing of that commission. 

Yes, but sadly, it is also a tough thing to tackle because of how people change their tune towards animals. Only the US has a gun issue, in the UK, it has a knife problem. Some Brits not only use these knife attacks on unsuspecting victims, but this was the case with those in regards to Animal Cruelty, either the crazed person is practicing to kill, enjoying committing harm, etc. Therefore, animals are also on the list with women and children in this area, but since we are focused on animals, some cases are just wild.

As pointed out everyone who acts under law are don't always have good intent, namely the police, who abuse their authority on people and animals. Since the focus is knives, an example would be Steve Bouquet, a former Royal Navy gunner who has been killing cats in Brighton, England just for the fun of it, to add more fuel to the fire, he had been watching disturbing videos of dog/cat related deaths/killings.

Over to the UK's ally, The United States of America, there are various cases, but the recent one being talked about is the situation with, to quote the memes, Lord Fauci, who experimented on dogs that are still barely alive. Reasons why [#ArrestFauci] was trending.

As for both, mainly in the EU/UK areas, there is also a bestiality problem, in some cases, such ill acts even committed by those of authority.

That being said, in similarity as to how to deal with abuse, when it comes to animals, it is a bit different, for in some cases detection can be flawed, in regards to cats/dogs, one can detect abuse just by physical attributes, etc. Therefore, the fact that this information is missing from OP, in connection to the rule of thumb for most in the US to leave well trained dogs unattended in some cases, it cannot be said it is animal abuse or and cruelty, but if the dog was untrained, causing trouble, etc. even when not watched, then, OP, @Isabella would have a case for that - therefore that remains to be seen, and it is most likely not all Americans know rules of thumbs for animals, likewise with people from the EU/UK.

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

16 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

If you can leave JWs for CSA, then you can do the same for Facebook and related media

 

16 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

That being said, in regards to CSA, I don't see how you continue to use said media, knowing what is hidden there as well, mainly when it comes to UK social media.

SM you are rather strange in your way of thinking.  I don't have any problem with UK social media. In fact I don't have any problem with worldwide social media. I am not the judge of this world. 

As for animals, a person wouldn't eat meat, drink milk, or use other things, if they seriously researched everything. 

BUT, none of us can be totally separate from this world.

I judged the Watchtower / JW Org because I was part of it. I had to judge it to make my personal decisions. There were two main points that i judged it on. Firstly, I was inviting families into the Org, and I now judge the Org as immoral and possibly a dangerous place for children to be... Secondly, i was handing out literature which contained things that I didn't believe, so I was acting as a puppet for the Org and distributing false information.  

Now as for social media, I don't go searching for rude or immoral things, so I don't know what 'hidden' things you mean. However it would seem that you have full knowledge of all the 'hidden' information there ????  

I can use social media and still have a clear conscience, as I use it in a constructive way not a destructive way. 

 

[Space Merchant]

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

SM you are rather strange in your way of thinking.  I don't have any problem with UK social media. In fact I don't have any problem with worldwide social media. I am not the judge of this world. 

You missed the point entirely. The media you use has been revealed, in connection to what the MSM in the UK is telling the general public vs what they're not telling them, evident only your reliance on sky news in some cases and what they are not trying to say to the public of the UK. In this you have to be very careful.

This has nothing to do with judging. The platform in question played a role in grooming of children, granted that is part of CSA, wouldn't that enable you to disband said connection to such media?

You told me once you love Facebook, and elsewhere, you left JWs for CSA, what is stopping you from doing the same with said media? Out of curiosity.

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

As for animals, a person wouldn't eat meat, drink milk, or use other things, if they seriously researched everything. 

And yet some jumped to conclusions of animal cruelty with not much evidence in the face of the rule of thumb concerning domestic animals.

This is true, but there are other aspects. You do not know the actions of those who handle said animals, this is why I mentioned the cow example. This is the same with fruit and produce, for you could be taking in chemicals in your body because of how the person(s) in question handles it. But to some that type of food is so good, they do not bother to inspect or clean or learn where it came from.

Seeing how things are in the US and UK, as is what Bill Gates have been up to, you may want to think twice about not only what you are eating, but the source of which it is coming from. Americans as well as British folks tend to consume too much of something that isn't good for them, something such as Soybean.

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

BUT, none of us can be totally separate from this world.

This has nothing to do with separation from the world, it is more so of taking action. What I conveyed to you is in connection with recent events.

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

I judged the Watchtower / JW Org because I was part of it.

Current or former, you just said you do not judge people and or persons. Ironically a while back you were quick to judge Islam, although you are not part of it. You should have chosen your words carefully.

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

I had to judge it to make my personal decisions.

That is an action though. So why not leave Facebook? 5k children, UK based, lured, groomed, drugged, etc. More even knowing to law, some situations so outlandish, some instances far worse that institutional CSA, so why not leave? Perhaps YouTube as shouldn't be used, granted, a child predator, of which I and a few others help terminate was brought back into the platform.

No one passed judgment but rather took action.

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

Firstly, I was inviting families into the Org, and I now judge the Org as immoral and possibly a dangerous place for children to be... Secondly, i was handing out literature which contained things that I didn't believe, so I was acting as a puppet for the Org and distributing false information.  

So what is stopping you from using media granted of how damning CSA is in media vs institutions?

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

Now as for social media, I don't go searching for rude or immoral things, so I don't know what 'hidden' things you mean. However it would seem that you have full knowledge of all the 'hidden' information there ????  

Then why not leave it entirely as you did the JW faith? CSA is quite rampant, hence what UK police was able to dig up. Ironically, this connects back to the events of Tommy Robinson.

3 hours ago, Patiently waiting for Truth said:

I can use social media and still have a clear conscience, as I use it in a constructive way not a destructive way. 

But it has CSA, surely you can leave it. If you can leave a faith for the same reason, it would not stop you from abstaining from it, as is with YouTube. Granted, you often times criticize those who has nothing to do with CSA but bring it up.

Facebook apps used in more than 5,000 child grooming crimes, says UK charity

The IICSA also found something interesting despite them never mentioning the person of status.

That being said, you always bring up CSA issues with JWs and even attest to the fact it was a contributing factor you left it, yet when it is anything else not JW related with the same issue, perhaps even greater, seems like the tune has changed.

As a side note, Bojo (Boris Johnson) said something quite demeaning to children recently about animals. It is not funny to joke about such things to children, granted what he said was mildly dark, if I may add. Children should not have heard such, as for animals, even the domestic ones, should not be subjected to what was professed; for it kind of shows how some in authority sees people, mainly the unvaccinated.

I recommending avoiding the people in the UK who blame their own for CSA, such ones cannot be reasoned with, mainly due to what is to come on your neck of the woods.

[Pudgy]

18 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

I recommending avoiding the people in the UK who blame their own for CSA, such ones cannot be reasoned with, mainly due to what is to come on your neck of the woods.

...UKs that usually have close set beady eyes, unusually large ears, and bad teeth. and eat scones buttered with "neck-o'-the-woods".