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24 YEAR OLD BETHELITE WOMAN RECENTLY DISFELLOWSHIPPED FOR APOSTASY COMMITS SUICIDE!


Jack Ryan

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2 hours ago, Anna said:

Of course people are entitled to their opinion. But that website is the most awful, uninformed and boring thing I’ve ever seen.  Not worth looking or listening to as there is very little that’s even relevant. It’s just filled with opinionated nonsense, and for someone to take their life over it, THAT is the real tragedy!

Back when I first began blogging, there was a fellow with initials DH who was a legend - albeit a somewhat embarrassing one - among apostates. Mention Jehovah's Witnesses anywhere and he was there with vitriolic, usually irrelevant comments. One I went to his own page. Prominently he offered his services for expert testimony in any anti-Witness lawsuit AND expert witness against the anti-depression pharmaceutical industry, apparently not realizing that each offer undercut his credibility for the other.

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So true. It's hard to imagine what kind of "spirituality" can live alongside certain kinds of sin and certain kinds of personalities. Most people go into the various Bethel branches, at about age

Unfortunately, that wasn't just true back in the '80's. I have seen the same thing and so have others - and it's not just true of NY Bethel. The trick for those of us who have lived through and seen t

It is one thing to speak frankly and honestly (rather than live in "pretend world") while also contributing to the spiritual welfare of our brothers and sisters. Some of our brothers and sisters in fa

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5 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

In the context of your excellent essay above, can you please give some specific examples of EXACTLY  how a person would " ... nail the Son of God to the stake again for themselves and expose him to public shame." 

Give me some specific examples of EXACTLY how it was done back then.

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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Give me some specific examples of EXACTLY how it was done back then.

I have no idea.... YOU used that scripture to support YOUR thesis.

You need to tell me why THAT scripture applies to the subject YOU were discussing ... If you can't ... it doesn't ... and you condemn yourself of  being a "theocratic bully".

6 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

For those in Rio Linda, that means it is DIRECTLY related to the thread of the discussion, and not just a "grabbed-out-of-the-air" scripture used as a bludgeoning tool.

JTR

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Woe to those who pride themselves upon modern techniques of REASON and CRITICAL ANALYSIS. Jesus showed disdain for all of them!!!!!.

He declined to be questioned by those who he thought simply wanted to justify themselves. Or who had ill intent. Or who were deliberately obtuse. Did he ever allow himself to be subjected to cross-examination such ones?

He evaded questions. He raised instead counter-questions. He told parables and illustrations, which he rarely explained. He employed ad hominem attacks. He raised strawmen galore. (because God wants men or all sorts to be saved, including straw men)

I can think of only one time he answered directly: when he was asked point blank, under oath, whether he was the Son of God or not. (I assume you are not going to go that way)

I am doing my best to imitate Jesus, that's all. Of course, Jesus can read hearts and people can't. But when someone assaults the internet with 7000 BELLICOSE COMMENTS you can come pretty close!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Imitating Jesus, here is a counter - question. 

Paul called the corrupt religious leader a whitewashed wall. When he learned who he was, however, he apologized, citing 'you must not speak injuriously of a leader of your people.

WITH FAR LESS EVIDENCE OF CORRUPTION, I CAN THINK OF SOMEONE WHO SPEAKS FAR MORE ABUSIVELY OF MODERN DAY LEADERS!!!!! CAN YOU???!!!!

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TTH:

I see that once again you have given  a Mel Brooks "History of the World - Part 1" to scatter the field with irrelevant to the discussion you yourself pontificated upon, debris ... but guess what?

DESPITE the whiny obfuscation, you still did not give a single, EXAMPLE of how these words you bludgeon people with ... and in this case a fine BUT IRRELEVANT TO ANY POINTS YOU WERE TRYING TO JUSTIFY WITH THAT SCRIPTURE.   

not one!

For those in Rio Linda that means ZERO, ZIP, NADA, GOOSE EGGS.

2 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

You need to tell me why THAT scripture applies to the subject YOU were discussing ... If you can't ... it doesn't ... and you condemn yourself of  being a "theocratic bully".

You know what a "theocratic bully" is?  

I can give you an example ...

PONTIFF.

Or anyone who bullies other people with irrelevant scriptures to support their fantasy agenda. The fact that you have to delude yourself FIRST does not make it better ... it makes it worse.

And your "but Jesus did THIS... and uh... Jesus did THAT" (paraphrased) is a pathetic attempt to hide naked behind a transparent plastic shower curtain.

OK... sigh ... ONE MORE CHANCE .... listen up ye of multiple personalities .....

...here it comes!

9 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

 ..... can you please give some specific examples of EXACTLY  how a person would " ... nail the Son of God to the stake again for themselves and expose him to public shame." 

.JTR

 

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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

And your "but Jesus did THIS... and uh... Jesus did THAT" (paraphrased) is a pathetic attempt to hide naked behind a transparent plastic shower curtain.

tromboneck:

Oh! ... I thought you were talking about the visual of TTH hiding behind Jesus' Robes, naked, wrapped in a transparent shower curtain, while beating up the brotherhood with a specific scripture he could not, or would not give a SINGLE real life example of what it meant.

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12 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

The reason it is not important to know specific identities is that they are but actors in a play (and one of them does not belong on the list at all, IMO). Take one of them out and they are immediately replaced by another.

Then it seems that Anna, JWinsider, and James Thomas Rook have a different agenda when it comes to wanting to know who Allen Smith is. They openly consort to believe, any new comer to this site is this person.

James Thomas Rook Jr. Well, AllenSmith ... and I assume you ARE Allen Smith, just trying a little deception ... (If I am wrong, please correct me...):

Anna. You must be Allen Smith then

JW Insider. I agree. Signed, Allen Smith

So, your comment on the latter is lacking.

On your other comments. Whether there are ex-witnesses, opposers here, it shouldn’t be critical to expose these people for what their true intent is.

As for active witnesses using this forum to voice derogatory, and slanderous claims just to have a negative impact on the Watchtower, mind you, with their PERSONAL OPINIONS, because of some negative experience they might have had within the Watchtower, then we must first use JESUS words.

But, first, think about the word “HURT” that you outlined. Assuming someone has been hurt within the church, and they wish to voice their concerns here. What then of being “HURT” by others at “work” “out on public” “family” “neighbors”, “friends” “husbands” “wives” “children” I have NOT SEEN any negative, or manipulative responses to the above if it's solely to be voicetrous and concerned. Are you stipulating that a church can be more hurtful, than your average life?

John 8:7King James Version (KJV)

So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

The website owner seems not to give equal opportunity for someone who is willing to expose those types of comments that become, a misleading message for the Watchtower. Then, that should have relevance to such opposition since as you stated “Some of them say that they were once hurt” on how these people are not expressing a personal opinion of being hurt, but, instead use this forum to denigrate a society that gives them the freedom to leave anytime they want, but instead misrepresent themselves to sway others with their agenda to have a negative impact not on the society, but scripture.

Ask then, why shouldn’t these people be exposed for having a manipulative agenda?

Witnesses, at one time or another, have been hurt for whatever reason, and usually, as you stated “There comes a time when one must suck it up and move on - either stay or leave, but move on.”, then couldn’t the same be said for the people here? I don’t see the difference unless the exposure is not equal to allow certain people to vent in an unethical way. Remember, scripture is being used. When one manipulates scripture to advance a personal cause, then how does that do any good for someone that visits this site and knows nothing about scripture but instead read disparities by a group of people toward others and their society. Any way you wish to look at this website, it would appear deceptive, then.

Galatians 1:6-12New International Version (NIV)

No Other Gospel

I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you to live in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospelwhich is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let them be under God’s curse!

10 Am I now trying to win the approval of human beings, or of God? Or am I trying to please people? If I were still trying to please people, I would not be a servant of Christ.

 

Where is Jesus words on all of this, “hurtfulness”. Where is GOD in all of this? Once again, why shouldn’t people be exposed for what their true intents are, and what they want to achieve by furthering their negative champagne to ridicule others in the name of scripture? Their “hurtfulness” is generating, “division” and “strife”. To advance their “own” personal agenda, not that of God’s.

Where do you see anything but “bad” in this? There, needs to be a voice of REASON. And people willing to spend their time, exposing these ungodly actions shouldn’t have a “negative” impact on the owner unless this is “exactly” why he is promoting this website. To be controversial just like the media that believe negative news sells just to generate income.

1 Corinthians 1:10-18New International Version (NIV)

A Church Divided Over Leaders

10 I appeal to you, brothers and sisters,[a] in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another in what you say and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly united in mind and thought. 11 My brothers and sisters, some from Chloe’s household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. 12 What I mean is this: One of you says, “I follow Paul”; another, “I follow Apollos”; another, “I follow Cephas[b]”; still another, “I follow Christ.”

13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized in the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so no one can say that you were baptized in my name. 16 (Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas; beyond that, I don’t remember if I baptized anyone else.) 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel—not with wisdom and eloquence, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.

Christ Crucified Is God’s Power and Wisdom

18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

2 Timothy 2:24New International Version (NIV)

24 And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful.

Doesn’t Timothy include those that get “hurt”? I appreciate your attempt to defend the indefensible, but the question still stands,

WHERE IS GOD IN ALL OF THIS?

 

1 Corinthians 3:3-5New International Version (NIV)

You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings?

What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task.

1 Corinthians 11:17-18New International Version (NIV)

Correcting an Abuse of the Lord’s Supper

17 In the following directives I have no praise for you, for your meetings do more harm than good. 18 In the first place, I hear that when you come together as a church, there are divisions among you, and to some extent I believe it.

 

For those of you that wish to leave a “DISLIKE”, I’m honored not to be part of the world.

John 15:19English Standard Version (ESV)

19 If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.

When someone posts an insidious claim, VERIFICATION is the best way to go!

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9 minutes ago, J.R. Ewing said:

Then it seems that Anna, JWinsider, and James Thomas Rook have a different agenda when it comes to wanting to know who Allen Smith is. They openly consort to believe, any new comer to this site is this person.

"Openly consort to believe"?

Hahahahaahaaaaaa.

Gimmee a break!

What does that even mean?

It's gobbledegook ... and has no meaning whatsoever.

And there is a difference between a working assumption, curiosity,  and belief ...

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