Did Jehovah’s Witnesses Lie to the Montana Court About Confidentiality?

[TrueTomHarley]

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Is it allowed to any female here to go into "deep and deeper discussions" about subjects that arose as topics?

Of course. Both @Anna and @Arauna do it all the time.

The thing that rankles about the other woman is that I have never seen such a massive collection of scripture put to no practical use whatsoever other than that of Absalom: ‘Yes, your matter is weighty and valid, but there is no one here from the king’s office who will hear you out—oh, if only I were king!’

Gender has nothing to do with it. It would be tiresome regardless of from where it came.

[Srecko Sostar]

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

6 hours ago, Arauna said:

You can do preaching work as a woman but no! You want a more important role!  You will not admit it.... but you want prominence. That is your Achilles heel. 

 

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Female person, according to @Arauna  in this comment, suggesting

 

[the Sower of Seed]

6 hours ago, Witness said:

As I’ve said here before, if I had hate for JWs, I wouldn’t be here.  I would walk away from the whole lot of you.  If we care about someone, and we know that person has made a grave error that will affect their life, we would speak up, right?  I have “brothers and sisters” in the organization that I care for.  I know they need to hear Christ’s truths.  Rev 11:1-3

While you reproach the Almighty God and doubt is ability to guide and instruct a people because some individuals within them sin.

Here is your greatest opportunity: Name the organization foretold in the Bible that :

2 Chronicles 7:14 if my people on whom my name has been called humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn away from their evil ways, then I will hear from the heavens and forgive their sin and heal their land. 

Daniel 9:19 O Jehovah, do hear. O Jehovah, do forgive. O Jehovah, do pay attention and act! Do not delay, for your own sake, O my God, for your own name has been called upon your city and upon your people.”

That has a central priest-like body foretold by prophetic parallels and scriptures.

They would be organized to do the will of God by: 

Faithful and Discreet Slave, Mtt 24:45

that is part of a greater body of anointed ones, Revelation 7:4, 

who are feeding themselves New spiritual light Daniel 12:4.

They are Preaching that there will be escapee's of a Great Tribulation Daniel 12:1

They are Preaching a resurrection of the dead on Earth of the wicked and good Daniel 12:2, Acts 24:15

the Faithful and Discreet Slave would be rooting out the lies and falsehoods,because of there seeing Jehovah and Christ hate the lies and liars John 17:17, Revelation 21:8

8 But as for the cowards and those without faith and those who are disgusting in their filth and murderers and the sexually immoral and those practicing spiritism and idolaters and all the liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur. This means the second death.” 

rooting out the lies and falsehoods like these:

 that God tortures the wicked eternally in a Fiery Hell,

or believe Jesus is the Almighty GOD YHWH,

or that Jesus was more than human while on Earth,

or that God will destroy the Earth,

or that God is a Trinity, a 3 head or dual godhead,

or that all good people go to heaven,

or that all religions lead to God,

or that God is supporting any of man's governments,

These would be transforming themselves individually as foretold at Isaiah 11:6-9. As seen at conventions of a vast mixed crowd of Jehovah's Witnesses. Revelation 7:9

This organization would be "obeying God as Ruler" rather than or above Men Acts 5:29

Isaiah 2:2 In the final part of the days, The mountain of the house of Jehovah Will become firmly established above the top of the mountains, And it will be raised up above the hills, And to it all the nations will stream.

These being called the Way and recognized worldwide as the True Worshipers of John 4:23,24

These are doing the expressed will of God ,Matthew 24:14 and Mark 13:10, preaching,teaching and announcing the Kingdom of God in the way that Jesus taught the Apostles, Matthew 28:19,20

during that time Jesus stated a generation would see people like yourselves EXPRESSING HATRED for Them because of the NAME they are called by. That Hatred would cause Persecution of those Doing God's Will.

this same generation would see world wars, great diseases and earthquakes and an increase in crime because the love for neighbor has faltered and people are visibly in disagreement among themselves and their government, especially the 7th world power of the US & Great Britain Daniel 2:43

They would see peace taken from the Earth and become faint out of fear,

They would see a days wage would only pay for the necessities of life

43 Just as you saw iron mixed with soft clay, they will be mixed with the people; but they will not stick together, one to the other, just as iron does not mix with clay.

This generation would see a pushing and a shoving between the King of the South and the King of the North Daniel 11:40 

 while keeping separate from war and the politics of this world John 17:14

Who are abstaining from blood and thing sacrificed to idols,

Acts 15:20 but to write them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from what is strangled, and from blood. 

who need no cross, saint or crucifix or any other material object to express their faith or pray before:

Exodus 20:4“You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or on the earth below or in the waters under the earth.5 You must not bow down to them nor be enticed to serve them, for I, Jehovah your God, am a God who requires exclusive devotion, bringing punishment for the error of fathers upon sons, upon the third generation and upon the fourth generation of those who hate me.

The disgusting acts of pedophiles are hated by God, He is rooting out a people on Earth who will respect His moral Code, not like Adam, but like Christ.

Here is your greatest opportunity: Name the organization foretold in the Bible

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[Srecko Sostar]

1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Of course. Both @Anna and @Arauna do it all the time.

 

1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Gender has nothing to do with it.

According to WTJWorg doctrine, women is not allowed to talk with men in a such manner to be or to look like, how she teach him/them. @Arauna highlighted somehow  this detail in her comment. And because of that, how Arauna's comment sounded to me, in my perception, it remind me on WT doctrine about interpretations of some Bible verses on women. 

In other way of perception, we can say also this way: If women "arguing" (with other male or female) in some specific kind, it could be sounded how she looking for "prominence" for herself, according to WTJWorg. It seems how choice of words, tone and attitude (in live or on paper) could be "judged" by this WT position.

As you see, WTJWorg culture have specific (as all groups) rules about inside member's behavior and also how behavior of members to outside individuals or group have to look like. Christian woman (JW member) according to this rules, should not put herself in position to "teach" adult males (only children) inside or outside of JWorg. 

Your "rebuke" directed to @Witness went by this WT rules about male-female relations. But in the same time you, as female, found no self-ban to doing same sort of "arguing" with @Witness (as woman) or me or some other "men" here. And that i found as funny (ironically), at least.   

13 minutes ago, the Sower of Seed said:

Name the organization foretold in the Bible

If i am right in perception, according to Bible, God never had an Organization, ....but He had a Nation. People for his name. And Individuals who was faithful and showed faith in His promises.

WT Society is not People, is not Nation. It is Corporation. CCJW are not People, are not Nation. It is Legal Entity produced, established by WT Company. 

[TrueTomHarley]

10 hours ago, Arauna said:

I would not advise anyone to visit these sites.... especially if they are not seasoned in reasoning about things.  Young people have too much responsibilities to have time to think. 

As much as I agree with the sentiments here, I have come to wish that young people were better prepared for whenever they might stumble across such a site—almost like a vaccinated person is better prepared for the plague once they encounter it. In an increasingly informational age, it becomes more and more likely that they will. 

Should they hang out there? Obviously not. The one common feature of these sites is that they feature people who are hypercritical to the nth degree, carrying on ad nauseam about complaints great and small. They are among the most unforgiving people on earth. Some of them will be blasphemous, filthy, and foul besides. Not a place to hang your hat. Even counselors in the general world speak of the advisability of cutting off “toxic relationships.” ‘Rocks submerged beneath the surface ready to rip the bottom out of your faith,’ is how the Bible writer puts it.

But to absolutely make it taboo to go there doesn’t serve young people very well either. In the event that they succumb to the most basic force of human nature—doing something because they have been advised not to—and are stumbled, there are barely any in the congregation who can help them because they don’t know what is there themselves. All they can say is: “Don’t go there!” Trust me, opposers are very skilled in turning that advice on its head. “Sure they don’t want you to go there!” they say, “they want to keep you in blinders!”

It is all very well for us to say it is like the devil with bad motive—“for God knows in the very day of your eating from it your eyes are bound to be opened!” but it is a tough sell. It is very easy to explain why ones ought to keep away from porn, from graphic violence, or from demonism. But from apostasy? ‘Are they wrong there?’ some will say. ‘I’ll just go there to see what they are wrong about, and then I will set them straight.’ Not all will reason this way. Not even most. But some will. After all, here they are advised to be bold with the Word at the door—for it is the all-powerful sword—but cowardly with it when it comes to ones who have rebelled and from there launch another attack on faith. 

Getting a measured glimpse of these apostates for any so inclined, when there are ones who can talk them through whatever they may find,  might almost be likened to lab class in school. See how some of the Bible themes play out—not just why people come into the truth—we surely know that—but why some leave. Let youngsters see, if they ask, how “Demas has forsaken me because he loved the present system of things.” Let them see how some have left “because they were not of our sort.’ Let them see what happens when people do not ‘take the rafter out of their own eye but focus on the straws of others. Let them see that mistakes can be made by old and young alike—it was certainly true in the first century—why should it not be true today? What has come to be a favorite saying of mine is: ‘The trick is not to sanitize the present—it is to desanitize the past.”

Will that happen anytime soon? Or at all? And should it? All above my pay grade. But it doesn’t seem likely. The counsel to avoid apostates is well-supported scripturally—Matthew 11, for starters. Moreover the GB takes on the role of the fine shepherd—they see the wolf coming and they beat it off, holding the sheep out of harm’s way as they do so. 

Still, in view of the poor track record we have with significant numbers of the young, maybe they will someday reassess and consider it a matter of degree. Surely, as ones who had “received the Law but have not kept it,” the Pharisees could be described as apostate. Could Jesus’ own manner of dealing with them be looked to as an example? He certainly didn’t seek them out. Nor did he argue with them when they approached to trap or attack. He wasn’t especially nice to them, really, though he always left open a way of return for any wanting to take it. 

I’d just as soon the young never run across these guys at all. But they do. And being totally unprepared and unfortified—something that could be effectively addressed but so far has not been—some stumble and there is no one able to help.

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Your "rebuke" directed to @Witness went by this WT rules about male-female relations. But in the same time you, as female, found no self-ban to doing same sort of "arguing" with @Witness (as woman) or me or some other "men" here

I can’t make head or tails of that. But I do note that Witness has told me I’m wrong no less than I have told her the same.

[TrueTomHarley]

11 hours ago, Arauna said:

I can go to the cumbaya groups and post pictures of myself on field service..... but I need more than this in a social interaction. 

‘The cumbaya group.’ Ha. I like it.

People’s places in life differ. Some find those sites just great. But I have told ones that I don’t come on the internet to find friends. I have more friends—in the congregation, circuit, and beyond—than I know what to do with. I choke on friends. So why would I come online in search of more, with ones whom you will never really know who they are because all you see is a digital persona? I, too, need more than this in a social interaction in the digital world.

[Arauna]

5 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

He wasn’t especially nice to them, really, though he always left

Yes, jesus only answered them when matters had to be set straight for the onlookers.

I do try to chat with young ones when I am on field service to prepare them for apostates and other shocks. Life is very complicated for young ones these days.  The world  has much more voice.

[Witness]

8 hours ago, the Sower of Seed said:

Here is your greatest opportunity: Name the organization foretold in the Bible

“You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord,
    “and my servant whom I have chosen,
so that you may know and believe me
    and understand that I am he.
Before me no god was formed,
    nor will there be one after me.  Isa 43:10

I have revealed and saved and proclaimed— I, and not some foreign god among you. You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “that I am God.  Isa 43:12

"Do not tremble, do not be afraid. Did I not proclaim this and foretell it long ago? You are my witnesses. Is there any God besides me? No, there is no other Rock; I know not one.”

"you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s special possession, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light."  1 Pet 2:5,9

The nation of priests since Christ, are tested, refined, and proven to serve God and Christ, to bring "healing to the nations" in the Kingdom of God. Rev 21:2

 No other "rock", or "foreign god" will prove to replace this spiritual people, nation.  Not even the "mountainlike organization" that you fully put your trust in.

It is the Temple of God, Mount Zion, soon to reach its completion.

"For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20 For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God."  Rom 8:19-21

“What are you, mighty mountain? Before Zerubbabel you will become level ground. Then he will bring out the capstone to shouts of ‘God bless it! God bless it!’”

"I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.  And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God."  Rev 21:2,3

The "dwelling place" of God is within the hearts of the anointed priesthood.  1 Cor 3:16,17  They are the "Bride" of Christ.

"The Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let the one who hears say, “Come!” Let the one who is thirsty come; and let the one who wishes take the free gift of the water of life."

 

So, when your leaders say, "come to Jehovah's organization for salvation", they are telling you a lie. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TrueTomHarley]

19 minutes ago, Witness said:

they are telling you a lie.

I could be wrong (fat chance) but...

I don’t think that was in any way, shape, or form an answer to the question Sower put to you. That was just you carrying on the way you always do.

9 hours ago, the Sower of Seed said:

Name the organization foretold in the Bible

In other words, you—riding in with the other true anointed that the Great 8 never allowed to speak with one another.

[Witness]

6 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

I could be wrong (fat chance) but...

I don’t think that was in any way, shape, or form an answer to the question Sower put to you. That was just you carrying on the way you always do.

He asked,

15 hours ago, the Sower of Seed said:

Name the organization foretold in the Bible

As Srecko stated, there is no earthly organization, but that God had a  people, a nation.  Since Christ, God's people, the "firstfruits" are "organized" within the Body of Christ.  James 1:18 I gave evidence according to the Bible, who that nation is comprised of. 

Don't tell me that you believe Zion is the Watchtower, where lawsuits are coming out of its ears, records of pedophiles are hidden within it, and "Beliefs Clarified" is posted on the information board.   I know you must be smarter than that.

 

2 In the last days

the mountain of the Lord’s temple will be established
    as the highest of the mountains;
it will be exalted above the hills,
    and all nations will stream to it.

Many peoples will come and say,

“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
    to the temple of the God of Jacob.
He will teach us his ways,
    so that we may walk in his paths.”
The law will go out from Zion,
    the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.  Isa 2:1,2

The Temple is not the organization and the "law" is not the Shepherd the Flock of God book.  

1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:20-22; Heb 8:10; Rev 5:9,10; 14:1; Rev 21:22

As for the "Great 8", (which is really clever),  the organization will make sure they are removed.  Rev 17:12,15-18

 

[Witness]

1 hour ago, Witness said:

  2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

I could be wrong (fat chance) but...

I don’t think that was in any way, shape, or form an answer to the question Sower put to you. That was just you carrying on the way you always do.

"Witness":  Don't tell me that you believe Zion is the Watchtower, where lawsuits are coming out of its ears, records of pedophiles are hidden within it, and "Beliefs Clarified" is posted on the information board.   I know you must be smarter than that.

 

 

[Witness]

On 1/13/2020 at 3:40 AM, 4Jah2me said:

But, if you put all your effort into walking 100 miles to a destination, you will not reach that destination if you are walking in the wrong direction because you have been misguided. 

The elders and dignitaries are the head,
    the prophets who teach lies are the tail.

Those who guide this people mislead them,
    and those who are guided are led astray.  Isa 9:15,16