"STANDING WHERE IT DOES NOT BELONG"

[JOHN BUTLER]

Look, the only people who have a clue that there even is such a thing as anointed as separate from every person just trying to be good is Jehovah’s Witnesses, 

Are you sure of this ? And are you saying that a person has to be a JW to believe in an Anointed class ? 

Are you saying that 'outsiders' cannot believe in the Anointed ? 

Once again Tom you only see things through the eyes of JW Org. 

[Witness]

In reference to scriptures used by Billy the Kid:

1 Cor 1:10 – “no divisions among you”.  Paul was teaching the new anointed members of Christ’s Body, who were “sanctified in Christ” and “called to be his holy people”, to be one under Christ. No divisions were to occur in the Body of Christ. 

Again, Watchtower’s take on the anointed ones today:

"In addition, anointed Christians do not view themselves as being part of an elite club. They do not seek out others who claim to have the same calling, hoping to bond with them or endeavoring to form private groups for Bible study. (Gal. 1:15-17) Such efforts would cause divisions within the congregation and work against the holy spirit, which promotes peace and unity."  Wt/16/1 pp. 22-27

Paul didn’t consider the anointed members bonding together as one body, an “elite club”.  He taught it was absolutely necessary for them to bond as one Body.  1 Cor 12:21-26

Together, through successfully surviving all that Satan would throw at them, they would be the Bride of Christ; and together, they would know truth as long as they remained in Christ. Together, they would reign on the earth as "kings and priests".  Rev 5:9,10

“As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him.”  1 John 2:27

 Who has the authority to divide Christ’s Body? 2 Cor 11:1-4   Who has the authority to transgress the Word of God and demand the Temple priests to remain separate from each other?

The elder body has been given this blasphemous authority, under the direction of the GB.  Rev 13:4-6,11,12

There is no scriptural validation for this, unless one has built his own "temple". In that case, he can authorize whatever he wants.  It will not be recognized by God, though, as worthy to receive His blessing.   Rom 1:25; Matt 7:21-23

Eph 4:11-13 also applies to the anointed.  1 Cor 12:27-31; Eph 4:1-4

There should be no division within the anointed body. Since it is obvious that there IS a determined division by decree of the GB, and what is promoted is unification of all members instead, there is no distinction made between what is holy and what is common; who comprise the holy priesthood and who do not.  There is no understanding of what God’s priesthood is assigned to do.  Lev 10:8-11; Ezek 22:26; Mal 2:7; 1 Pet 2:5,9  And, they have submitted themselves to this falsehood; they have allowed those who rule over them to keep them divided.  1 Cor 12:25  Division causes desolation to what should be a united people, a special possession of God.  1 Pet 2:9

The Watchtower quotes from the October 2017 magazine that I gave early, state that “Jehovah’s spiritual temple” is the entire organization.  Within that idolatrous “temple” there is to be no division among its members. 

Does God recognize it and bless it?

ARE ALL JWS, NOW PRIESTS?

ARE ALL JWS, CHRIST’S BRIDE?

When the Man of Lawlessness is “set up” in God’s Temple, (2 Thess 2:4) it “exalts himself” above the Temple priesthood.  He ‘opposes’ the Temple of God,  by dissolving the defining element between the  holy and common. 

2 Thess 2:4 – “set up”:  “sitteth” – “to set, appoint, to confer a kingdom on one, to fix one’s abode”, “to seat oneself”   

It has been accomplished by the elder body "representing the royal priesthood".  

JWs, the Temple of God in the anointed priesthood has been replaced by an idol – “Jehovah’s spiritual temple” called the Watchtower organization. 

It is the accomplishment of “false christs” and a destructive “Beast”/organization/elder body.  Rev 13:1,11

"For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect."  Matt 24:24

Matt 24:15 - When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

“the holy” - most holy thing, a saint

“place” – “place, any portion or space marked off, as it were from surrounding space, an inhabited place, as a city, village, district”

Addressing the saints:

  1 Cor 3:16,17 - Do you not know that you (the saints) are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells (an inhabited place) in you?

The only “holy place” Jesus recognizes is the Temple of God built on his Body.  If anyone can discern this, if anyone can visualize the desolation of God's Temple, they are to flee.  Matt 24:16

Pearl Doxsey - "The Disgusting Thing", 4womaninthewilderness blogspot

[Anna]

2 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Are you saying that 'outsiders' cannot believe in the Anointed

They do believe in the anointed. They believe every single person is anointed because they all believe they will go to heaven...

[Anna]

On 3/18/2019 at 3:03 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

So, "my truth" about it till the 2015, the year of my leaving JW,  was true also.

Actually, the elder I mentioned previously has had a beard for many, many years, while an elder, well before 2015.

[Anna]

On 3/18/2019 at 2:18 AM, BillyTheKid46 said:

In one account, a group of Chilean youths stormed the KH, took down the JW.org flag and replaced it with a Chilean flag.

Who told you this? But one thing doesn't seem believable, and that is actually replacing a jw.org flag. I cannot imagine there was a jw.org flag in the window. In fact why would the Chilean brothers have a flag, its usually just a plaque outside the KH. 

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

ONLY if YOU PERSONALLY have intellectual integrity ... will you follow the TRUTH  ... wherever it leads.

No human on Earth that lives, or has ever lived, is exempt from this.

OTHERWISE ... you are subject to theological hallucinations ...

And everything you see, think, and do will be duplicitous ... and as you stated above ...

24 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Therefore, I wouldn’t know if a flag pole “holder” would be fixed to a KH over there, where certain KH are forced to comply.

The fact that looking straight at it .... AT IT ... you declare you do not know .... perfectly illustrates my point.

[Witness]

2 hours ago, Anna said:

They do believe in the anointed. They believe every single person is anointed because they all believe they will go to heaven...

Not all of them.  Many are seeking out the true anointed ones/"Daughter Zion"   Isa 62:1-12

[Witness]

22 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

In retrospect, How would you define calling yourself one of the anointed?

The anointed who realize there is no unity allowed under a counterfeit priesthood, are "thrown out of the synagogues", because they speak against such blasphemy.   John 16:2  They leave captivity to an operation of error, and join Christ.  I have found anointed who follow only one Master. 

 

[TrueTomHarley]

10 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Can someone claim to be one of the anointed, while not meeting the standards of Christian ethics? Can someone endorse a person, seeming to preach as the anointed without fulfilling the conditions set forth as a Christian?

This is the second time you’ve mentioned annointed in addressing me. I hope you don’t think that I claim to be annointed.

You will know the day that I am annointed when you read a Going Out of Business sign in heaven.

[TrueTomHarley]

10 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

If anyone is above reproach, the husband of one wife and his children are believers and not open to the charge of debauchery or insubordination. ⁷ For an overseer,as God's steward, must be above reproach. He must not be arrogant or quick-tempered or a drunkard or violent or greedy for gain, ⁸ but hospitable, a lover of good, self-controlled, upright, holy, and disciplined. ⁹ He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it.

This is better, Billy, but it is still not good enough. The Benefit book says that you must specifically make the connection. Presumably you think this verse will serve as counsel for me or you would not have quoted it. How will it help? What part of it applies? Do you think that I have three wives or that I am a drunkard? For your posts to do what you want them to, you must always say what you mean.

And all those passages on conscience. How do they apply? I’ll come to Thessalonians presently, for in this I am pretty sure I know what you mean.

The opening verses, too. I can guess, probably accurately, what you mean. But it would still be a guess. I could be wrong. It would be better if you said it. That’s the best way to give counsel.

 

[TrueTomHarley]

2 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

If I simplify it any further, I  would have to use a crayon and wait until spiritual maturity sets in.😉

Now now now. You threw this in as an afterthought and you should have left it out. Why not just say: “I am wise. Everyone else is stupid.”? It comes across as judgmental, Billy. And it serves no purpose. You have been at this for some time now, trying to make people behave on this worldly site as though they are in the Kingdom Hall. How’s that project going, anyway? If you choose to write on this forum, you must not write with only brothers in mind. You must write primarily for the non-Witnesses that might be lurking about. The brothers get their counsel at the Kingdom Hall.

It cannot be done--converting the worldnewsmedia into a congregation. You only shoot yourself in the foot when you try and you leave a not-so-hot witness by saying things like the above. The internet is not the congregation and cannot be made to behave like one. From where did you receive the commission to declare: “Only 40 days more and the worldnewsmedia forum will be destroyed for its great badness”? You didn’t.

It could be argued that you are the most hypocritical one here. I have made no bones about being a bad boy in certain respects. Were I obedient to all aspects of counsel, I would not be here. That is equally true of you, but you don’t acknowledge it. Do you think the GB says: “There are a lot of yo-yos on that ‘out there’ website, but thank God, we have our man Billy to straighten them out”? No. They say: “Oh, man, that TTH is a screwball and now that gunslinger Billy is also carrying on! How come they don’t listen to us and stay on better channels?”

I am encouraged, Billy, and probably you are too, that ‘loyal’ ones seldom appear on this open club. If they come online, they stay in the closed club, which is spiritually more healthy. I like that. Don’t you? It shows an obedience on their part that neither you nor I display.

I have explained to you more than once my reasons for disregarding counsel on internet association. You don’t accept it, but they are still my reasons. I am a brother neither servant nor elder, though I have served in those capacities previously. I am universally liked in my circuit because I am a peacemaker and I am not wound up too tight, though there are probably a few who think I am a windbag. What am I going to tell them—that I’m not? Recently two elders approached me to say they would like to use me more in the congregation, but was there anything to the rumor that I associate with apostates? I told them that there was not, however what I did came close enough that it might easily be taken that way, and if we apply the direction given young people to all adults, then it clearly was that way, so for that sake we all decided it better to leave things just as they are.

I told them why I did what I did—that I learned a reporter who wrote several bad articles about us used a certain apostate Internet forum as his sole source. ‘If that’s the case, maybe others do as well. Maybe I can go there and plant some things that are more balanced,’ I told myself. I have put several long posts there, but afterwards I do not hang out. Each post produces a flurry of protests and I briefly answer a few, but after that I disappear. It is not a course that I recommend for others, and brothers usually get their heads handed to them on a platter when try, being severely outgunned and unprepared for the sheer onslaught that they trigger. It is being disobedient to counsel for me to do it, and I do not try to spin it otherwise. I would not presume to do it but for senior years, a long honed ability to write—if you do anything long enough, you tend to develop a knack for it—and enough humbling circumstances in life that I am not likely to become overly full of myself, much less go the way of these characters.

The rules are different here, Billy. It is not the congregation. If you knocked on a householder’s door who was a known ne’er do well and when he answered you saw some brothers inside, you might say to them: “Um, guys, do you really think that you should be here?” But if they did not respond, what would you do? Would you feel it your place to barge into that householder’s home and make those brothers behave as they ought? It is kind of what you are doing here.

We must respect our hostess here and abide by her rules--the Librarian, that old hen.

Given that I have chosen to be online, I commit no wrong in whatever association I have with @JW Insider. He has committed an extraordinary indiscretion, in my opinion, and I have done my duty as a brother in exhorting, even rebuking him, in the way that is most effective for me—by a skit painting him as the friendly but incredibly naïve poker player who fans out his full house for all to see. That’s about all I can do but it is what a brother should do. It will all be lost on him, most likely, because he sings the "theocracy dies in darkness" mantra more fervently than Jeff Bezos. Do you think that he ought to be disfellowshipped? If so, note that he is not, or at least if he is we don’t know about it, and can therefore with good conscience treat him as in good standing. And why is that the case--that he is not or that we don't know? Because this is the internet, and the internet cannot be made to behave as the congregation. Persons ought not be here if they cannot get their heads around that.

 

[TrueTomHarley]

You know, @BillyTheKid46, having written what I just did, there's a part of me that wants to take it all back. it is very hard to address a dozen different points of view expressed here at once and I think I overestimate my ability to rise to the occasion.

It may be that everything is exactly as you say. At any rate, I'll keep mulling over the verses you have spotlighted.