IICSA Inquiry - Child Protection in Religious Organisations and Settings 10 August 2020

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

Quote C. C. "since you are taking the judgment of God and telling him, his structure of government doesn't meet the requirement your heart desires."

Oh dear, more burbling. You still mix up God with the CCJW.  God and Christ are not related to the GB and the CCJW. 

My 'judgement' is of a dishonest disloyal group of 8 men, known as the Governing Body of CCJW, that have given themselves power over others.  These 8 men have judged the True Anointed and have placed themselves above the True Anointed.  These 8 men have judged that they are the F&DS and that no one else is worthy of that title. 

My  'judgement' is also of the CCJW as I needed to judge them for the sake of my Christian conscience. How could i have left them if I didn't judge the organisation as immoral ?  

Anyone that just follows a life of habit in any religion is not being true to God, Christ, or themselves. Each person has to judge everything they do to be able to make use of their conscience. If a person has a good Christian conscience then they will judge fairly and honestly, as I did. 

I am surprised that millions of people have not left the CCJW. It only proves to me that JWs are puppets. It seems that JWs are quite happy to live with the immorality in the CCJW as it serves JWs as a social club.  They seem to have no Christian conscience. 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@César Chávez Quote "  Don't you think, secular authority need to understand the kind of bias they are dealing with or have you related that to them, the hatred you feel about the Watchtower GB. "

My dislike of the GB was not involved in this case. 

But a good point, and yes I have related to the Police the circumstances of me leaving the CCJW. 

At the bottom of my email to the Police I wrote a paragraph entitled 'Background'. 

It helped to explain why i could not get more information due to 120 people in the congregation no longer talking to me. It also stated that if my name were mentioned in their enquiry then they would probably be met with untruth about me and about the 'incident' concerned. I also mentioned that it would probably be difficult for them to gain any information from any of the Elders of the congregation. I did also mention that I am not sure if the Elders were actually informed of the incident.  So hopefully the Police can bypass the congregation and go directly to the people concerned. 

 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@César Chávez  Where you go totally wrong is by comparing your GB to Moses. And by comparing the CCJW and Watchtower to the early Christian congregations.

You seem to fail to understand basic truth. The 1st century Christian congregations were set up by Jesus and the Apostles. Jesus and the Apostles were inspired of God's Holy Spirit.  Many of those 1st Century Christians were Anointed ones, maybe all of them.  You will remember the 120 in the 'upper room' that received Holy Spirit and began speaking in different languages. 

No one in the CCJW or Watchtower is inspired of Holy Spirit. The GB are the leaders of both organisations and the GB admit that they are NOT inspired of God's Holy Spirit. 

I do have the right to judge, as do we all. Otherwise why are 8½ million people JWs ? Many of them came out of other religions. They judged their former religion and then left their former religion.  Everyone makes judgements every day. That's how people make decisions.  

The scriptures you quote had more meaning when they were actually spoken because they were spoken either by Jesus or by Anointed men. They were spoken to Anointed ones.  The Greek scriptures are for the Anointed.   Luke 12 v 48

Berean Study Bible
But the one who unknowingly does things worthy of punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be required; and from him who has been entrusted with much, even more will be demanded.

The True Anointed have been given much and entrusted with much, so much more is demanded of them.

I can take judgement from any man and laugh it off, because i know I will be judged by Christ in the end. And as I'm not Anointed then maybe not so much will be demanded of me. I have not forsaken God or Christ, I have only judged an immoral organisation that pretends to serve God. The same way that the CCJW judges the Catholic church and other organisations. 

I could tear your comment apart bit by bit but i see no point. You and I have totally different opinions which we are both entitled to. If God through Christ wants to use the CCJW, then God through Christ will cleanse that organisation. If not then God, through Christ, will build another organisation using the True Anointed. 

But right now the GB are a cause for stumbling, and they are restricting the True Anointed from doing their work. Ref; Luke 12 v 48,  How can the True Anointed do what's demanded of them if they are not even allowed to meet together for prayer and Bible study ? 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@César Chávez Quote If you were a righteous advocate, you'd be enraged by James action. Why aren't focused on that?

If I were enraged I would be judging James as guilty. Do you know and do you have proof that James is guilty ?  I doubt it.   As a Christian I will not judge James on an accusation.  

Quote "but let's not change the subject just because you have no genuine credibility with secular authority,"  What is that supposed to mean ?  I have no credibility with you is what you actually mean. 

Quote "A judgement that is NOT yours to have, since you were NOT directly involved, but rather told."

What judgement did I make by reporting the possibility that a child might be in danger ? And also reporting that a young man might need help.  

Just because you would rather 'pass by on the other side of the road', just as the Jews in Jesus' parable, that does not mean I should do the same.  My Christian conscience made it clear to me that I should do as I did. 

I would be very hypocritical if I didn't report, when I complain that Elders didn't report the same type of thing about anyone. Not reporting a person allows that person to continue to be a danger to others. And the possibility that a child continues to be abused. 

But of course you don't seem to care about that. JWs just want their Organisation to look clean, even though it is full of immorality.  

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@César Chávez  True Christians are supposed to be no part of this world. So, true Christians do not support a government or leader of this world. If a true Christian were to give support to a politician or leader of a country then they would be guilty of being part of this world. 

Transfer that to the CCJW / Watchtower. The GB are guilty of suppressing the true Anointed, misusing scripture and hiding paedophiles in the CCJW organisation. So, anyone supporting the GB and remaining in the CCJW are guilty of the lies and immorality. 

I have previously had conversation with James over these issues, the same as I have had conversation with @JW Insider and @TrueTomHarley and others.  Anyone that remains part of the CCJW at this time, is guilty of supporting a Governing Body that is not serving Almighty God properly and guilty of being part of an immoral organisation. 

Those issues are separate from what James is being accused of.  The issues I have mentioned above have been proven. James' innocence or guilt has not been proven, or I have not seen evidence of it. 

But it would seem to me that you want to convict James, but pretend that the CCJW / Watchtower is clean and pure. 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

Quote @César Chávez  an immoral act is an immoral act, no matter how small or big it is. 

I agree with you on that point, but, as far as I am aware,  nothing has been proven against James.

But you are seen here to be making the accusation against James as if you have proof. 

As for your 'Llyod Evans' comment, you show yourself to be very silly.

I have started a book recording information which condemns the CCJW / Watchtower.

Australian Royal Commission, Reclaimed Voices (Netherlands), Charity Commission (UK), IICSA (UK),

numerous law suits in America and Canada, The Utrecht University report in the Netherlands, and in February of this year the Pennsylvania Attorney General / Grand Jury started it's investigation into the CCJW.  

But you still worship your GB and it's immoral Org.

I am actually concerned about people that defend this immorality. It doesn't seem normal for people to want to hide Paedophiles in their Organisation.  Maybe it's people like that, that have lost all credibility with Almighty God and Christ. 

 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@César Chávez It really is a waste of my time conversing with you, but for  the sake of anyone else that might be reading all this I will reply. 

There are a few big differences between JTR and your GB. 

JTR is an individual. He is not a leader of 8.5 million people. 

JTR does not call himself the Faithful & Discreet Salve.

JTR is only responsible for himself and possibly his wife. 

The GB have given themselves the complete responsibility of 'feeding the 8.5 million sheep'. 

The GB dictate the man made rules for running the CCJW.  

Therefore the GB are responsible for hiding hundreds if not thousands of Paedophiles in the CCJW Earthwide.  THIS HAS BEEN PROVEN BEYOND DOUBT. 

The amount of court cases and investigations PROVE how wrong and immoral the GB and CCJW Org is.

I cannot understand why you cannot admit that your GB and the CCJW are immoral and dishonest. 

CC, Everyone judges people and situations. Jesus judged the Pharisees. And Jesus will judge us. 

You really do seem hung up on condemning James. Your choice of course. I would rather wait to find out if he is innocent or guilty.  IF he is guilty then he should pay the penalty.

BUT so should all the Paedophiles in your CCJW org pay the penalty of the Child Sexual Abuse and suffering they have caused. And your GB should pay the penalty for all the suffering they have caused to people and their sins against God and Christ. 

[Srecko Sostar]

1 hour ago, César Chávez said:

Are Elders supposed to be lawyers? No!

This have interesting connotations. But according to the role assigned to them by the JW organization, they should be: shepherds who take care of all the needs of their flock, investigators, prosecutors, defenders and judges in cases of "wrongdoings" made by flock.  It would be to much to expect from them to be lawyers too. :))

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

@César Chávez  I think you are unwell. Maybe you should see a doctor or psychiatrist. 

You are obviously not well enough to understand and use good English.  I do worry about you. 

I don't know why you keep referring to 'the Watchtower' as I have been writing about the CCJW. 

Get well soon. 

[Srecko Sostar]

6 hours ago, César Chávez said:

No spiritual leader should be a lawyer when it comes to spiritual things.

For sake of discussion. Old Jew Law written by Moses consisted of many legal acts, paragraphs. People who were supposed to deal with the problems of the nation and individuals needed to have a very good knowledge of the law and how the law should be applied in a particular case. So, it is normal to accept the reality of the fact that such "spiritual leaders" were in a way "lawyers", because a deep knowledge and understanding of the law, and its application, meant one thing: the implementation, the administration of justice.

What kind of "spiritual leaders" would be those who do not know the law and all the applications of the paragraph in that law. So, “spiritual leaders” had to study, think, and discuss the law with themselves and with other “spiritual leaders”. Therefore, we can conclude that these people were forerunner, part of a system, called today by a special vocabulary - “lawyers”.

"Biblical legislation," both that of the past and that which is related to Christianity, is based on "spirituality." This would mean that “spiritual leaders” do not have one role, for example to deal with questions of celebrated birthdays, holidays, whether 144,000 is a literal or symbolic number, whether a Christian is allowed to have a tattoo, whether Michael is Jesus Christ or not, and so on. “Spiritual leaders” prescribe and enforce decisions about the behavior of their members.

The behavior of the members is sometimes inconsistent with the "biblical legislation", and sometimes it is also inconsistent with the "secular" legislation. “Spiritual leaders” should be well acquainted with both types of legislation. For “secular” legislation is related to God’s decision, and explained in Romans 13. For the same reason both classes of people, “spiritual leaders” and “church members” must submit to “secular” legislation. And “spiritual leaders” since they are “leaders” to their “members,” then they must guide them not only through “biblical legislation” but also “secular” legislation. That means being a “leader”.

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

I will forgive @César Chávez as Jesus said we should forgive. And also because I think he/she is unwell emotionally and spiritually. 

CC seems to have judged both James and me. but for different reasons.  That's fine with me. 

CC wishes to defend an immoral organisation where cases against that organisation have been proven. And CC wishes to defend the GB even though it can be proven that the man made rules of that GB have caused stumbling and suffering to many Christians. We should remember Luke 17 v 1&2. 

We should also remember Luke 14 v 11. regarding the GB.   The GB will indeed be humbled. 

As for James, I just hope he is dealt with in an honest and just way by the Superior Authorities that stand in place because God allows them to be there. And if James is guilty of crime then he must pay that price decided by those Superior Authorities. Also if James is guilty of sin then he needs to ask forgiveness from God through Christ. 

So there CC, I have not defended nor condemned James.  We are all sinners and constantly need to pray for forgiveness. 

 

[Patiently waiting for Truth]

I wrote  And if James is guilty of crime then he must pay that price decided by those Superior Authorities. Also if James is guilty of sin then he needs to ask forgiveness from God through Christ. 

So there CC, I have not defended nor condemned James.  

Then C.C. says, 

Quote @César Chávez You are defending James Thomas Rook Jr an immoral man that was or still is part of the same organization,

How does one get through to such a person as C.C ?  Firstly I have said I am not defending James.  Then anyone can see that C.C. is slandering James as C.C has no proof, yet condemns James as  an immoral man. 

And then C.C. says, about him/herself " What I need is to obey and have faith in God." 

I would suggest then that you remain neutral in you thoughts and words about JTR. 

Quote "Since you JUDGE,  then you can be judged"  I really don't mind being judged by any human, in fact i find it amusing. 

God will judge me, through Christ. That is the only important judgement. 

I'll await your next silly comment CC