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By whose order are JW's being persecuted around the world?


Srecko Sostar

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What they are saying is that the final attack (that prompts Armageddon) is not made up of separate attacks.   I don't know. But regardless who the attacks come from, they are usually becau

WT GB theology, supposedly biblically grounded, and most important, under the guidance of the Holy Spirit as GB say, explains why people suffer, why there is great evil in the world, and especially wh

ng @Srecko Sostar You seem to have done some research and some deep thinking.  @Witness You too have done research and deep thinking, but along different lines.  @Anna seems to just be defen

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19 hours ago, César Chávez said:

Then you would have to agree, the ARC is NOT a good role model, since it's public knowledge what the Australian government attempted to hide with the aid of the ARC.

 

You are wrong on so many counts. For instance 

Matthew 23 v 1 -3 

Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying:  “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the seat of Moses.  Therefore, all the things they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds, for they say but they do not practice what they say.

Here is an example of Jesus using  'NOT a good role model' but showing how they should be obedient to instruction whilst not copying example. 

Add to this the scripture at Romans 13

 Let every person be in subjection to the superior authorities, for there is no authority except by God; the existing authorities stand placed in their relative positions by God.  Therefore, whoever opposes the authority has taken a stand against the arrangement of God; those who have taken a stand against it will bring judgment against themselves.  For those rulers are an object of fear, not to the good deed, but to the bad.d Do you want to be free of fear of the authority? Keep doing good, and you will have praise from it; for it is God’s minister to you for your good. But if you are doing what is bad, be in fear, for it is not without purpose that it bears the sword. It is God’s minister, an avenger to express wrath against the one practicing what is bad.

Now, God knew that those worldly Superior Authorities were not serving Him and not living by Christian principles, but God still uses them to serve his purpose. So if God allows them to have the authority and if God is using them as minister and avenger against bad, it would be wise for Christians to obey those authorities as long as they do not conflict with God's 'laws'.

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50 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:

Therefore, all the things they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds, for they say but they do not practice what they say.

Here is an example of Jesus using  'NOT a good role model' but showing how they should be obedient to instruction whilst not copying example. 

In "normal circumstances" every religious leader and every politician and every average person will tell you: Be good, obey god, obey law, be honest, speak truth etc, etc.

GB members in "normal circumstances" doing exactly this, teaching their flock to be good people. But behind curtain they instruct lawyers to speak things that are not giving real picture about what is going on, that are not the truth but deceiving and manipulative.

In matters of doctrines and directives, JW members need to be very cautious about words too. In such context i would take Jesus' words relatively. :) 

 

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43 minutes ago, Srecko Sostar said:

GB members in "normal circumstances" doing exactly this, teaching their flock to be good people. But behind curtain they instruct lawyers to speak things that are not giving real picture about what is going on, that are not the truth but deceiving and manipulative.

In matters of doctrines and directives, JW members need to be very cautious about words too. In such context i would take Jesus' words relatively. :) 

Their actions are catching up with them.  The world is beginning to see the double-dealings of the GB.  Only those who are "stiff-necked" in their defense of these so-called "spiritual betters", will continue to support their leaders, until their leaders fall.  (Jer 17:23; Rev 17:15-17)

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16 hours ago, César Chávez said:

Then you would have to agree, the ARC is NOT a good role model,

I didn't say anything about the ARC being a good role model. It merely helped us to see areas where we could improve. 

16 hours ago, César Chávez said:

However, you seem to imply, the Watchtower only reacted after the ARC inquiry

Yes, the WT did react to the suggestions of the ARC. I know because I listened to the whole thing, I heard the suggestions, and I could see those exact suggestions were being implemented in the 2016 WT study, and the "Child protection" packet on the website. This had never been done before the ARC inquiry. There was never one place accessible to everyone outlining our policies regarding child protection. It was always in articles here and there, and in letters to the elders. Never in one place like this. Now everyone can be on the same page. The changes that were made were changes suggested by the ARC.

16 hours ago, César Chávez said:

Does that mean, witnesses should be dismissive of ALL the Watchtower publications and ALL the Body of Elder letters posted after 1970?

Of course not. The old advice was good advice. But it lacked in certain areas, and those areas were identified in the ARC hearing. After the 2016 WT study article, many brothers and sisters were extremely grateful for it.

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2 hours ago, Witness said:

Only those who are "stiff-necked" in their defense of these so-called "spiritual betters",

No, no—you misquoted me. I did not say “spiritual betters” in an absolute sense. I said they are your spiritual betters, because they actually do things in furtherance of the good news and are not merely non-stop bile towards the doings of others. They are your spiritual betters—not necessarily those of faithful ones in general.

One could almost endure you if you acknowledged their faith and work. Similarly, one could almost endure you if you pointed to something better, or even equal. But no! All it is is non-stop vitriol on those actually doing something in the work of the Lord, while doing nothing yourself—or at least nothing that you reveal.

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2 hours ago, César Chávez said:

However, witnesses need to have a clear understanding of many unfounded truths that came out of the ARC 2016 inquiry.

.... many unfounded truths ....

This sentence is weird. If something is "Truth" than that is based on proofs and is grounded on facts.

Lies are unfounded. In other words, subject don't have sound basis.

It is not possible for Truth to be unfounded. 

Some JW members have unfounded conclusions and prejudices about ARC because they heard Rumors about ARC. You contribute to this rumors. GB member G. Jackson endeavored to do everything possible so that the WT would not be held accountable for its members who had been exposed to violence in the past, or would be in the future. Another fact have to be clear to JW people too, how some of them will be CSA victim inside JW Congregation. ARC Inquiry and Report showed what was wrong with WT Policy. And 2016 WT study article what @Anna  mentioned, i guess, said nothing about WTJWorg  errors and wrongs and damages which arose due to bad policies and instructions which the elders had to follow. 

2 hours ago, César Chávez said:

Therefore, your view should be unacceptable to any honest witness.

I am sure @Anna don't need me to defend her position on this but she is honest enough and your statement are unacceptable and need to be dismiss.

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2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

No, no—you misquoted me. I did not say “spiritual betters” in an absolute sense. I said they are your spiritual betters

I knew that. 🙂  In fact, I've shared your opinion of me, with other anointed ones whom I work with, because it is a very catchy phrase.   A "faithful slave", who also believes they are every other anointed one's, "spiritual betters".  Matt 24:48-51

2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

One could almost endure you if you acknowledged their faith and work.

I acknowledge that they do put their faith…in their works (organization, building, expanding, and misleading its members with lies)…

2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Similarly, one could almost endure you if you pointed to something better

…and not in something better, which I had told you previously. 

https://www.theworldnewsmedia.org/topic/88239-just-how-big-of-a-debacle-was-the-prophesy-of-1975/page/8/?tab=comments#comment-150784

2 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

or even equal. But no!

What were you expecting, another earthly organization?

 

 

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46 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

The political equivalent of this is known as QAnon.

You're suggesting that we are being influenced by a conspiracy theory?  Or rather, are we being influenced by the Holy Scriptures?  You do say I use a lot of them.

"For there is nothing hidden which will not be revealed, nor has anything been kept secret, but that it should come to light." Mark 4:22

 

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16 hours ago, César Chávez said:

I couldn't agree more Srecko. The unfounded truth is suggestive to ex-witnesses such as yourself that believe they're truth has merit. Therefore, those truths are unfounded, since they are NOT based on facts just a lot of double-talk and misleading conjecture. If it sounds weird, then you would have to apply it, to unfounded false claims coming from opposers. Only, "integrity" separate both kinds of truth, as you say one side would end up being lies.

Perhaps i have another explanation on this. If You or I or anyone else believes in something that it is, must be "the truth", all other dialogue or arguments or facts means nothing to such person. The truth is only what I believe to be true. :))

17 hours ago, César Chávez said:

Just remember, my opinion was in general terms while you'res is specific. 

Is this possible to interpret how WTJWorg GB have opinions in specific terms and JW members in general terms? And by that personal faith, spirituality and understanding stops on general terms level?

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