Why doesn't the Society translate and provide the Russian Court Transcripts for us?

[TrueTomHarley]

15 minutes ago, Arauna said:

I am not over-reacting.... or vitriolic.

You seem to feel that I had you in mind in my last comment. I didn't. The idea of coming to the aid of immature ones who are playing in the street, not realizing the dangerous drivers deliberately trying to swerve into them, appeals to me. That's what you are doing.

 

14 minutes ago, Arauna said:

I am not here to determine if people have a mental illness

I am. Well - I guess I'm not - not really. But there a few serial gripers who seem unhinged, and I do not think it wrong to observe that.

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

This is GREAT!

I am laughing so hard at the irony of this I can't find my hinges!

[Arauna]

I agree with your on the serial gripers!  The hinges are on the ........ 

[Arauna]

They cannot cater to individuals - I think there is a handful who want to read it ...... and the opportunities were there before.  I read some of it. ...... so obviously you are ignoring my previous comment or you do not like the answer. 

[Srecko Sostar]

5 hours ago, Arauna said:

I speak from a worldly perspective.......We are not different to other people - the same as everyone else.  The only difference is that one cannot remain a Witness without Jehovah's spirit.

Apologize if i am little boring in responding to your comments, but as you know already - "When words are many, transgression is not lacking"

I would like to point to one problem that arise in JW Organizational perception and perception from JW member. If JW member want to be true Jesus follower than he need, must to reject "worldly perspective" in purpose to be more close to Jesus personality and imitating his faith and to show "fruits of spirit", and to dress on "new personality". Purpose is in that true Jesus disciple can be different (in positive way) from people who do not want or wish or are not familiar with "godly personality". That is possible as you already wrote with JHVH spirit. 

So, you are confusing yourself and us who reading your thoughts with opposite standpoint, again, - "your worldly perspective" how it is need to deal with people who are lazy or have other kind of problems in JW church AND with your suggestion, request that all true JW member, including yourself, have to show "JHVH spirit".  But is it good, possible to mix "worldly perspective with JHVH spirit" and in the finals be satisfied in own eye, and in eye of other christians how our position before god is very well?   

5 hours ago, Arauna said:

but people expect the JW organization to be

If you think about JW people expectation, here is good to say how all people have some rational and irrational "expectation" about congregation and people inside  and WT organization at all, and on Bible interpretations about present and future promises that was made by GB. :))))

5 hours ago, Arauna said:

With money that other witnesses pay for.....With money that other witnesses pay for ...

Here i would like to say, how is not Natural that some people supporting other people who are health and able to work with own hands and earn money for daily bread. So this WT organizational arrangement (Bethel, missionary, pioneers, some traveling elders) where some people are in position to live on other people's expense is not normal. It is like in Catholic church against which WT talking a lot, but shows similar illness in this matter.

Have a good evening  

[Srecko Sostar]

Why doesn't the Society translate and provide the Russian Court Transcripts for us?

Legal Department and lawyers which are involved in process have documents. Own and from prosecutor. But have no obligation to put it in public. Whether they have documents (transcripts) it depend, i think, did they ask for transcript, did Russian court have obligation or not to produce transcripts to lawyers. 

But no matter on reality did they have or not documents, JW members are "not authorized, entitled to hear confidential informations"  :))) and will never be!

 

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

SS:

I am afraid you are correct about that ... so I have decided to write the Russian Embassy in Washington DC ... and the Governing Body in Warwick, New York, asking BOTH for English Language Transcripts, with a link to this thread for context, and see who, if anybody responds.  I am also going to enclose a check for twenty dollars, each ... and ALSO see who does and does not cash the checks.

It will probably be Monday next when I get to it.

I will post the results, if any, here.

As a precaution, I will also try to find some SPF 5 Million sun tan lotion.

 

[Witness]

@James Thomas Rook Jr.,  I am responsible for contributing to going off topic, for which I apologize.  If you can bend just a bit more, I would like to make one last comment on this thread to Arauna, but I’m all for moving it to another spot, since you have that ability, and I don’t. 

@Arauna You interpret my words against the organization as pride and arrogance.  Perhaps since you are, or were, a businessman, they intrude on your firm belief to uphold the concept of “organization”.  Have I resisted God and Christ in what I’ve said, or have I supported them?

8 hours ago, Arauna said:

Why do people expect JWs to tolerate all kinds of bad behavior when organizations in the WORLD do not even tolerate it?

Where do you think the organization exists?  Perhaps in “middle earth”?  What tools does it use to thrive, tools of some spiritual source not tainted by Satan’s world? It uses what any other organization does, which exist in Satan’s world. The Wt. is part of the world, there is no getting around it.

Nowhere in scripture is the organization’s existence supported.  Jesus rejected the “organization” of his day.

 “Look, your house is left to you desolate.  For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord’”  Matt 23:38,39

His words can help us realize that no longer is any earthly entity to be endorsed by God.

Remember when his disciples were enamored by the beauty of the temple?

“Look, Teacher! What massive stones! What magnificent buildings!”  Mark 13:1

(Sidepoint:  It was said in a JW broadcast that people have made the comment, Warwick; it’s setting and building achievement, is like “paradise”.)

 ^“Some of his disciples were remarking about how the temple was adorned with beautiful stones and with gifts dedicated to God. But Jesus said,  “As for what you see here, the time will come when not one stone will be left on another; every one of them will be thrown down.”  Luke 21:5,6

Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days.” They replied, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and you are going to raise it in three days?”  But the temple he had spoken of was his body.  John 2:19-21

Jesus was eluding to his “Body” of anointed ones who would become God’s new “Temple” – dwelling – house – New Jerusalem – Holy City – Zion.   Isa 60:14,13; 1 Cor 3:16; Heb 12:22,23; Rev 14:1

“After he was raised from the dead, his disciples recalled what he had said. Then they believed the scripture and the words that Jesus had spoken.”  John 2:22

Do you believe his words?  1 Cor 12:27; 3:16,17

He reinforced this “new wine” (Luke 5:38) when speaking to the woman at the well.

“Our ancestors worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews claim that the place where we must worship is in Jerusalem.”

 “Woman,” Jesus replied, “believe me, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.  You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews.  Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.  God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

Still, we find no evidence of a centralized earthly place of worship to come.  Jesus specifically stated as such.   If these scriptures are presented to the elder body by one who rejects the idea of an organization, what happens?  If anyone questions its existence, by bringing ‘darkness to light’ (1 Cor 4:5); it is through the doctrine of men, that one can be disfellowshipped.  John16:2; Heb.13:13; Mark13:13; 8:35

“However, the Most High does not live in houses made by human hands. As the prophet says:

 “‘Heaven is my throne,
    and the earth is my footstool.
What kind of house will you build for me?
says the Lord.
    Or where will my resting place be?
 Has not my hand made all these things?’

The Watchtower claims that kingdom halls, assembly halls and Warwick are “God’s house”, which according to the scriptures is a lie.

“You stiff-necked people! Your hearts and ears are still uncircumcised. You are just like your ancestors: You always resist the Holy Spirit! Acts 7:51

Would you say Stephen acted arrogantly by stating the truth, which were words supporting the new “Temple” arrangement?  He was stoned for revealing it.  Disfellowshipping is a spiritual “stoning”. For supporting what God has built, which is the anointed Body of Christ and refusing to give credence to an idol; also, for one’s “testimony to Christ”, the Watchtower spiritually “stones”an individual, causing families to be fractured, and labeling them as apostates.

Jesus said this would happen.  Matt 5:11; Luke 12:51-53; Rev 13:7-15; Rev 12:11

There will never be justice in the organization, because although you zealously believe God endorses it, he only endorses what he has built – the Body of Christ.

Wt., through the direction of Satan, has created the “strong delusion”, an “operation of error” - that what man has built, is necessary for salvation.  2 Thess 2:9-12; Col 2:8; Rev 13:10  This delusion that God allows or “sends” has no other purpose than to “sift” the “remaining ones of the woman’s seed”. Luke 22:31; Rev 12:17,3,4 Will they choose the false “safety” of the organization or the true fortress found only God?  The Wt. is highly efficient in building up its perceived protective “fortress” and people believe it, they are admonished to do so. 1 Thess 5:3; 1 Pet 5:8; Ezek 13:10-14

Our spiritual heritage can also infuse in us a deep sense of spiritual security that can be enjoyed only within Jehovah’s organization. w05 2/15 pp. 17-22 

Invariably, this counterfeit “Zion” has let thousands of people down, and as you have effectively done, the blame is put back on them for their “lack of faith”; apparently in God.  In reality, they lose their faith in the organization, which in many instances then destroys their faith in God.

I posted the video to point out that people are waking up to the Watchtower idol, yet Bethelites have been “let go” for no reason and I believe you may know that. 

“The wicked borrow and do not repay,
    but the righteous give generously

I have seen a wicked and ruthless man
    flourishing like a luxuriant native tree,
 but he soon passed away and was no more;
    though I looked for him, he could not be found.

“The salvation of the righteous comes from the Lord;
    he is their stronghold in time of trouble.
 The Lord helps them and delivers them;
    he delivers them from the wicked and saves them,
    because they take refuge in him.   Ps 37:21,35,36,39,40

 

I am sorry that you don’t realize that anointed  ones can be sealed while still on the earth – either in the spirit of Satan, (John 6:70;13:2; 17:12; Rev 9:11) or in Christ (Heb 12:22; Rev 12:13,6,14).    Blame the Watchtower.  

 

 

 

[Evacuated]

4 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

So this WT organizational arrangement (Bethel, missionary, pioneers, some traveling elders) where some people are in position to live on other people's expense is not normal.

You're just jealous aren't you?

[James Thomas Rook Jr.]

3 hours ago, Witness said:

@James Thomas Rook Jr.,  I am responsible for contributing to going off topic, for which I apologize.  If you can bend just a bit more, I would like to make one last comment on this thread to Arauna, but I’m all for moving it to another spot, since you have that ability, and I don’t. 

For complete and unrestricted freedom of speech, I will bend myself into a pretzel!

I LIKE a "free association", "who knows where the conversation will lead"  semantics and subject brawl.

It's called "Thinking Out Of The Box" .... and I am all for it.

THAT way ... when you discover "New Light" ... next year you just add to it, because it was correct to start with!

 "Old Light" is just darkness, mis-labeled.

.

 

[Anna]

9 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

I am afraid you are correct about that ... so I have decided to write the Russian Embassy in Washington DC ... and the Governing Body in Warwick, New York, asking BOTH for English Language Transcripts,

Never know with you, are you actually being serious?

[Anna]

10 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Natural that some people supporting other people who are health and able to work with own hands and earn money for daily bread. So this WT organizational arrangement (Bethel, missionary, pioneers, some traveling elders) where some people are in position to live on other people's expense is not normal.

They do this full time, so when would you expect them to go to work to earn money for a living?