Will people who have committed suicide get a resurrection?

[Evacuated]

18 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

And who is this Shirley?

Get some glass in yer hornrims!

[Space Merchant]

On 9/20/2016 at 10:35 AM, Shiwiii said:

Which scripture do you have in mind to support this? I'm just curious. 

Bible records show some examples of people committing suicide. Although we find no commentary with these incidences, such is covered in principle in the 6th Commandment, therefore, suicide is an act of murder [killing of oneself and or other]. 

That is, if one is to take in what the Laws found in the Torah are all about, with the inclusion of the Ten Commandments.

[Space Merchant]

12 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Will people who have committed suicide get a resurrection?

 

Assuming they would OTHERWISE be resurrected, think about THIS:

Jesus deliberately went on a known "suicide mission" and died because of that decision.

It usually depends. As I mentioned in the other thread, someone I know committed suicide due to the pornographic and adult industry as well as her being exposed to public, resulting in her ending her own life, the media who make the news of my late friend tends to spin the information, knowingly.

Other instances being those who have been victim of and or affiliated with anything of the occult, examples such as any man, rich, poor, strong, weak can be subjected to a thing called Black Magic, to my people, it is refereed to as Vodou. If caught off guard, one would either be victim of taking his or her own life and or those affiliated with that influence are hunted down. My cousin was victim due to the fact she was intelligent. Her death was ruled out as suicide in the country, but it was murder, and the only reason it is that way because the corruption of government officials know who's side they are on. Her death was a very, very violent one, another motivation for me to believe what the Bible says about resurrection because her, and my friend, as with others do not have to succumb to that.

Then you have those who kill willfully others and or themselves.

 

As for Jesus, he knew what was coming and he also know that his own God and Father would raise him again, of which took place. But I have to admit, what they did to Jesus before killing him was brutal, can't imagine how bloody things are, but saying that now, I can picture something, granted it isn't nothing surprising of which I have ever seen in the present day of things.

[Srecko Sostar]

"He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”

If looking from this point perhaps they not need resurrection (in a interpretation that is common to this point of understanding) , because they are alive to HIM already/now. Or they will be in some way and meaning and some kind of fulfillment.

:))) problem coming because so many verses exist in The Holy Book

[Shiwiii]

4 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

Bible records show some examples of people committing suicide. Although we find no commentary with these incidences, such is covered in principle in the 6th Commandment, therefore, suicide is an act of murder [killing of oneself and or other]. 

That is, if one is to take in what the Laws found in the Torah are all about, with the inclusion of the Ten Commandments.

So let me ask you this then. As your position holds close to that of the jw, at death is that sin not paid for? I mean the wages of sin is death right? See, I do not subscribe to the idea that once I die all of my sins are paid by my death, it merely means I no longer have the ability to perform more sin. I am only washed clean by the blood of Jesus and my faith in Him. I can't see how suicide is an option if your faith is in Jesus. So in essence, I agree that suicide is wrong and possibly a sin, but I just want to know what is being used as support for such a claim.......especially by the jw, because of the wages of sin = death thing. 

[Srecko Sostar]

If we want to answer the question in the title, we may also need to answer to this (as first/primary question or as dual question, together with this in title): What is the difference in whether a person takes life to another man or takes life to himself?

[Melinda Mills]

 

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

If we want to answer the question in the title, we may also need to answer to this (as first/primary question or as dual question, together with this in title): What is the difference in whether a person takes life to another man or takes life to himself?

(Genesis 9:6) ⁶ Anyone shedding man’s blood, by man will his own blood be shed, for in God’s image He made man.

 (Proverbs 28:17) ¹⁷ A man burdened with bloodguilt for taking someone’s life will keep fleeing until the grave. Let no one support him.

 Both of these remedies would be difficult to achieve for a man taking his own life. So there is a difference in taking your own life and taking someone else’s life.

 (Revelation 21:8) But as for the cowards and those without faith and those who are disgusting in their filth and murderers and the sexually immoral and those practicing spiritism and idolaters and all the liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur. This means the second death.”

 Murder is something willful and thought out. Note what the scripture says will happen to murderers.

*** w02 6/15 p. 30 Questions From Readers ***

If someone commits suicide, would it be advisable for a Christian minister to give the funeral talk

….

Any future prospect for the dead is in the hands of Jehovah, and no one is in a position to say whether the deceased will be resurrected or not. The minister can concentrate on the Bible truths about death and offer comfort for the bereaved.

 =====

You seem quite capable of doing your own research.

[Srecko Sostar]

34 minutes ago, Melinda Mills said:

 

(Genesis 9:6) ⁶ Anyone shedding man’s blood, by man will his own blood be shed, for in God’s image He made man.

 (Proverbs 28:17) ¹⁷ A man burdened with bloodguilt for taking someone’s life will keep fleeing until the grave. Let no one support him.

 Both of these remedies would be difficult to achieve for a man taking his own life. So there is a difference in taking your own life and taking someone else’s life.

 (Revelation 21:8) But as for the cowards and those without faith and those who are disgusting in their filth and murderers and the sexually immoral and those practicing spiritism and idolaters and all the liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur. This means the second death.”

 Murder is something willful and thought out. Note what the scripture says will happen to murderers.

*** w02 6/15 p. 30 Questions From Readers ***

If someone commits suicide, would it be advisable for a Christian minister to give the funeral talk

….

Any future prospect for the dead is in the hands of Jehovah, and no one is in a position to say whether the deceased will be resurrected or not. The minister can concentrate on the Bible truths about death and offer comfort for the bereaved.

 =====

You seem quite capable of doing your own research.

Thanks!

So, according to your respond, can we tell how  Bible said nothing specific about; is taking own life sin or braking some god's law or braking some secular law?

Talking about WT opinion, would be advisable even to go to funeral and to go and give a speech making this thing (suicide) as something shameful, to be judge as inappropriate act of person, and maybe to "mark" family as not appropriate society for community.  

As you see, in my opinion, it is not of such matter Would person who committed suicide  be resurrected, but,  would /will family, friends and JW congregation show comfort, understanding, compassion and love to those who live!?

[Evacuated]

2 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

would /will family, friends and JW congregation show comfort, understanding, compassion and love

Bit like the fruitage of the sprit (of which love is mentioned) "Against such things there is no law". Gal.5:23.

Like so many of such questions raised in this forum, this is a matter for individuals to decide. 

 

Dugogodišnja sloboda.

[Space Merchant]

On 9/26/2018 at 5:44 PM, Shiwiii said:

So let me ask you this then. As your position holds close to that of the jw, at death is that sin not paid for? I mean the wages of sin is death right?

The position has been held by a majority of Christians early on, even predating the Jehovah's Witnesses, for instance, the same position can be read in The City of God, by Christian philosophy Augustine of Hippo, 5th century regarding thou shall not kill [be it of oneself and or others]? Once again take the time to look into this information instead of always assuming such a belief is based on a sole faith, the information I paraphrased from was from the United Church source, for this belief predates Jehovah's Witnesses itself and such a belief is still in relevance today and onward.

As for Romans 6:23, the wage(s), or penalty, for sin is death, for in the beginning, no one was a sinner, hence why that verse points to a verse in Genesis, to be more specific, Genesis 2:17. Adam and Eve were created as perfect beings, and all their offspring would have been born as perfect themselves, resulting in no reason for anyone to perish in death. Adam and Eve and all their offspring had the prospect of eternal life in happiness, but due to disobedience, it resulted in Ancestral Original Sin, committed by our first human father and mother and everything that took on afterwards.

Our Father, our God, not only is of total justice and power, a God of love. So he takes the initiative to take, and fix what has been broken. Therefore when we read this verse, Romans 6:23, we can draw the context, especially when we understand it and what it says in part B into C of the verse, but the gift God gives is eternal life by means of Christ Jesus our Lord, for this part of the verse points to 1 Timothy 1:16, 1 John 2:1, 2 and Jude 21.

On 9/26/2018 at 5:44 PM, Shiwiii said:

See, I do not subscribe to the idea that once I die all of my sins are paid by my death, it merely means I no longer have the ability to perform more sin. I am only washed clean by the blood of Jesus and my faith in Him.

A person who has died his or her sins do not stand against him/her. For if it was not for the sacrifice of our Lord, Jesus, and God’s purpose and will that pertains to the resurrection, an individual, he/she would never live again if that were the case.

Regardless, one would remain acquitted from sin, as God would not review the case of the sinner and then sentence him to other kinds of punishment for his sin, for God is Just and according to his purpose, will and order such ones will be held accountable and it will be between said individual and God when that day comes.

That is the great thing about Jesus sacrifice, it provides this amnesty and paves a path for us regarding Salvation.

The thing is about suicide, is that it isn't an option, it is something that is done so willfully and or other by people depending on various situations, be it positive and or negative, some who try to commit and then change afterwards had no idea as to why they were going to do the act in the first place, of which is not always common with those in such a position, others attempt to do so out of depression, fear, and other things, the things I have seen in my case, was due to things of the occult, such as Vodou, that can bring even the strongest of the Christian faith down.

But God is a God of mercy, it will be up to Him dealing with various persons who commit such an act, and the reasons as to why they did so.

On 9/26/2018 at 5:44 PM, Shiwiii said:

I can't see how suicide is an option if your faith is in Jesus.

It isn't an option, but by means of the individual itself, such a path is often chosen, not by anyone else but that individual, as said before this path is chosen by means of various situations, sometimes willfully, mainly to those who are depressed and the like, such ones we should be trying to help out.

Even those who have faith in Jesus and his God are also subjected to this, and some have taken their life, others were helped out before anything bad took place.

On 9/26/2018 at 5:44 PM, Shiwiii said:

So in essence, I agree that suicide is wrong and possibly a sin, but I just want to know what is being used as support for such a claim.......especially by the jw, because of the wages of sin = death thing. 

I've already mention what comes from the Law regarding the Ten Commandments, Thou shalt not kill [Thou shalt not murder], but often times in other cases, some ignore this so they can willfully kill someone else who they think is a threat, at times, or in another discussion had had elsewhere Christians killing Christians and so forth.

Now, for this is where the support and belief stems from in the Christian faith itself regarding the commandments. It isn't far-fetched for Jehovah's Witnesses to have that view, for as stated before, they are Restorationist, and other Christians who are putting forth the practices and teachings of early Christians and the Church, also share this view.

As for mainstream Christendom, they tend to go over such in order to take part in something that is not of God.

[Space Merchant]

On 9/27/2018 at 12:40 PM, Srecko Sostar said:

If we want to answer the question in the title, we may also need to answer to this (as first/primary question or as dual question, together with this in title): What is the difference in whether a person takes life to another man or takes life to himself?

There is no difference. When a person dies, by his or her hand and or causes someone else to die, it results in a death for an unnecessary cause, not of God, not of the Word, etc by means of the willfulness and negativity of man in some cases, for instance, someone would kill themselves because they didn't win over the heart of some girl/woman, other times, they will kill someone and either flee or attempt murder-suicide, example, Virginia Tech 2007, nuff said. However there is the whole maintaining faith til death whereas some people will actually die in some process to prevent loss of salvation and or the like, but not a suicide I wouldn't say, for instance, if someone came to your home and tells you to stop reading the Bible, denounce God, curse His name, you, having free will have 2 options, you either cease your faith and or maintain it, although the outcome will not be so pleasant, something of which is indeed a reality in Christian persecution.

[Shiwiii]

On 9/29/2018 at 5:57 PM, Space Merchant said:

A person who has died his or her sins do not stand against him/her. For if it was not for the sacrifice of our Lord, Jesus, and God’s purpose and will that pertains to the resurrection, an individual, he/she would never live again if that were the case.

Regardless, one would remain acquitted from sin, as God would not review the case of the sinner and then sentence him to other kinds of punishment for his sin, for God is Just and according to his purpose, will and order such ones will be held accountable and it will be between said individual and God when that day comes.

That is the great thing about Jesus sacrifice, it provides this amnesty and paves a path for us regarding Salvation.

This part I don't agree with, or maybe I'm not following you completely. 

 

Without faith in Jesus, none of your/my sins are forgiven. Yes, our sins are washed clean by the blood of Jesus, by means of faith, not by us dying. Jesus didn't die for all mankind in the sense of those who reject Him, but rather those who put their faith in Him.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

This is where the Romans 6 verse is misused in my opinion by all who claim that upon death all people's sins are erased. This is also where I was drawing the question. If one believes that suicide is a sin and that Romans 6:23 absolves all sin upon death, then suicide cannot be wrong/sin because instantly that sin would be erased, nullifying the whole thing.