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[Witness]

32 minutes ago, Arauna said:

Fornication - if your son had proof of this - he himself was guilty as an accomplice -  because he did not let the elders know.

At that point, he would have been labeled by today's standards a "PIMO" - physically in, mentally out.  I doubt very much that he had any regard whatsoever for organizational protocol.  He had seen its abusive tactics over the years already, used against his own father.  

 

33 minutes ago, Arauna said:

So your own thinking is warped as you assisted your son to accuse the elders …….but not to be part of the solution to the problem - to show courage and go to the elders and provide evidence,  ....…...or at least warn them so they could talk to the young man.....about his partying and drinking. 

Arauna, I lived a hundred miles shy of a thousand, from my son at the time.  I didn't hear of this until he decided to move back home.  

35 minutes ago, Arauna said:

So your example is not proof of injustice and 'privilege' but proof of a sons cowardice to show integrity to snitch on buddies, which is as destructive as self-righteousness.

Yes, please do blame my son and myself for another person's hypocrisy...if that makes you feel better. 

 

[Witness]

37 minutes ago, Arauna said:

You quote this scripture but you still think it OK to mix with such ones on a social level?

Can you tell me where I said that?

[Srecko Sostar]

1 hour ago, Arauna said:

So your example is not proof of injustice and 'privilege' but proof of a sons cowardice to show integrity to snitch on buddies, which is as destructive as self-righteousness.

If we put this observation and conclusion on "next level", it is similar how elders showing "cowardice" and not reporting CSA to the ONLY AUTHORITY that is in charge to deal with CRIMES according to Romans 13 ... to the "secular authorities".

Well obviously , WTJWorg have problem in detecting what is "sin" and what is "crime".

[Arauna]

1 hour ago, Witness said:

he would have been labeled by today's standards a "PIMO

I do not think you ever were witnesses - you had a 'form of godly devotion' as the bible says.  JWs are taught not to fear labels... whether in your imagination or for real. Your excuses are just too absurd. You most probably strengthened him in his cowardice, painting him a victim of privilege.... when he helped to cover up wrongdoing by choosing to keep quiet in the congregation. 

 

2 hours ago, Arauna said:

You condemn us for disfellowshipping such ones?  Where is the hypocrisy? hhhhmmmmm.

Don't negate  the point.  You quoted several evils that come from various scriptures...… the point is you detest these qualities and actions, yet you find fault with us for not mixing socially with these kinds of people......

[Anna]

16 hours ago, JW Insider said:

This is exactly at odds with Gnam's claim that normal family life goes on.

I think this has been discussed somewhere before, that in fact Gnam's claim was correct, that is, in the context of a family member living at home, which would naturally apply to husband and wife, and any children that were currently a part of the household. But, the claim was deceptive because it did not clarify this, and allowed for the assumption that the topic included ANY family member living inside or outside the home, in other words in a broad sense, which is how most people view "family". 

[Anna]

17 hours ago, JW Insider said:

Frequently Asked Questions section is still there, but that particular article has been removed

I think it's still there. Under "Becoming a Witness"

[Srecko Sostar]

2 hours ago, Anna said:

I think this has been discussed somewhere before, that in fact Gnam's claim was correct, that is, in the context of a family member living at home, which would naturally apply to husband and wife, and any children that were currently a part of the household. But, the claim was deceptive because it did not clarify this, and allowed for the assumption that the topic included ANY family member living inside or outside the home, in other words in a broad sense, which is how most people view "family". 

Of course !! Every "normal worldly human" have no specific reason to understand and to accept JW abnormal rule that makes separation and difference about family member who living in house, out house, in a basement or on first floor, near house or on other planet. Family member is family member, alive or dead, JW or non-JW or ex-JW.

[Arauna]

1 hour ago, Srecko Sostar said:

abnormal rule

You are denying all the scriptures in the bible which refers to this.  So you are deliberately obtuse.  you are saying God is making an abnormal rule......You talk like an atheist. Why should I take you seriously when you do not take the bible seriously.  You say you accept the bible …… but only the parts you like.

[Srecko Sostar]

2 hours ago, Arauna said:

You are denying all the scriptures in the bible which refers to this.  So you are deliberately obtuse.  you are saying God is making an abnormal rule......You talk like an atheist. Why should I take you seriously when you do not take the bible seriously.  You say you accept the bible …… but only the parts you like.

Please, if i omitted to put Bible verse/s to bake my opinion, would you be so kind to put: 

Bible verse/s that clearly said

1) how you have to shun dfd family member who don't living under same roof with faithful family members?

and Bible verse that clearly said

2) how you can talk with dfd family member who living under same roof with faithful family members?

If you would not be able to provide such scriptures than i will politely ask you to not make claim how i am person who denying scriptures (in fact scriptures that not exist in reality). Only existing thing is WTJWorg extended interpretations of Bible verses.

 

PS Your and WTJWorg extended interpretations are so similar with examples of Jew who want to be very strict and righteous about Law which forbade working on Sabbath. And They made explanations with long list of what work is and what work is not. :)))

[Witness]

9 hours ago, Arauna said:

I do not think you ever were witnesses - you had a 'form of godly devotion' as the bible says.  JWs are taught not to fear labels... whether in your imagination or for real. Your excuses are just too absurd. You most probably strengthened him in his cowardice, painting him a victim of privilege.... when he helped to cover up wrongdoing by choosing to keep quiet in the congregation. 

 

If I had been in that same congregation, (not a thousand miles away) I know that as a faithful elder's wife I would have not even conceived covering up the wrongdoing.  

9 hours ago, Arauna said:

I do not think you ever were witnesses

Well, Arauna, believe what you want.  I must tell you that I tend to agree with @4Jah2me that you are a very bitter person.  I have my doubts about this statement of yours:  

"Sorry if I come across that way. I am the least bitter person you can ever meet. Sweet, friendly and open... no bitterness."

But, I give you the benefit of the doubt, knowing you suffer from arthritis.  One day can be good, the next, miserable.  I know pain can be a barometer gauging one's attitude for the day.

 

9 hours ago, Arauna said:

Don't negate  the point.  You quoted several evils that come from various scriptures...… the point is you detest these qualities and actions, yet you find fault with us for not mixing socially with these kinds of people......

What kind of people?  Repeat offenders? I've already covered that.  I am sorry to say, you already mix with repeat offenders.  It's quite obvious if you care to look.  They are spiritual "harlots" who lead you in falsehoods.  (Rev 13:11,12; 17:1-6)

As I said earlier - 

21 hours ago, Witness said:

Disfellowshipping is an across-the-board condemnation for everything from smoking, celebrating Christmas, drunkenness, infidelity, fornication, murder, child abuse, rejection of the organization and the GB’s leadership, etc.  In ALL cases, shunning is expected.

Do you have the ability to read every heart?  Does the elder body?  Did Jesus shun sinners?

"Now it happened, as He was dining in Levi’s house, that many tax collectors and sinners also sat together with Jesus and His disciples; for there were many, and they followed Him. 16 And when the scribes and Pharisees saw Him eating with the tax collectors and sinners, they said to His disciples, “How is it that He eats and drinks with tax collectors and sinners?”

17 When Jesus heard it, He said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.” Mark 2:15-17

 

 

 

[JW Insider]

9 hours ago, Anna said:

I think it's still there. Under "Becoming a Witness"

Thanks, that was a big miss on my part. I did a few jw.org searches and google searches, but misremembering the exact phrase. It's even still available right there in the FAQ directory. https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/shunning/

I didn't click it from Learn more about us and our beliefs. because that looked like the place where the site lists out the 15 major beliefs: (https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/jehovah-witness-beliefs/)

The problem is that previously the shunning article was there if you went to the FAQ page https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/

Currently if you click on that FAQ link, you get 16 articles and the shunning article is no longer included among them, and there is no place to click for more. (I assume this is why the Wayback Machine stopped picking it up in 2019.)

Thanks for the correction.

[Witness]

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

PS Your and WTJWorg extended interpretations are so similar with examples of Jew who want to be very strict and righteous about Law which forbade working on Sabbath. And They made explanations with long list of what work is and what work is not. :)))

Excellent thought. 

Disfellowshipping is spiritual condemnation.  At times the elders may admit they have wrongly condemned an individual, and it may take years before its notice.  These events are rare.  Condemning one's spirituality isn't to be taken lightly, but for the sake of the cleanliness of the organization, it is commonplace.  

 

"Judge^[a] ("Condemn") not, that you be not judged. ² For with what ^[b]judgment ("Condemnation") you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you. ³ And why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye? ⁴ Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove the speck from your eye’; and look, a plank is in your own eye? ⁵ Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye."  Matt 7:1-5