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JOHN BUTLER

Jehovah speeding up the work or increase. But increase or decrease ?

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Space Merchant -
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The JW Org / GB say that Armageddon is very close. They also say that Jehovah is speeding up the work in these 'last days'.

Now, it seems I'm not one for knowing truth from lies, so people keep telling me, but this webpage/site seemed interesting to me.

 It seems to show more of a decrease in JW's, but more importantly it seems to show more of a lack of faith, or lack of action / 'works' of JW's. It also shows a large number of people leaving the JW Org. 

If this video or page has been used before then I apologise for any repeat. But I thought it was of interest. 

    Hello guest!

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If you believe this do something about it, if you don`t believe it don`t do anything. 

By they way Jehovah doesn`t go on numbers (people)

 

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On 6/12/2019 at 3:09 PM, Outta Here said:

Could be clearing out the trash? Comp. Matt.13:41

There has been a lot of talk about God and the Bible lately as well. In a sense, by what is common. And those who are in opposition, have thrown morals out the window.

 

Butler, you are pulling old information, as I had address before, the demographics of adherents in this regard of the faith group have been increasing, especially an increase talk about God and the Bible. They will be hitting the 9mil mark soon.

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19 hours ago, Space Merchant said:

They will be hitting the 9mil mark soon.

I'd say you're right. Based on current rates, the peak publishers number should reach 9 million in 2021 and the average publishers should reach 9 million in 2022.

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3 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

73% of all Jehovah's Witnesses who do not stay?

This is a  highly subjective estimate related to to a very suspect sampling of responses. Regardless, estimates of expected numbers of publishers do not include those who lapse. And there is no survey figure available on how many were lapsed and then reactivated amongst the current publisher figure.

Notwithstanding the flaky estimate of PEW, an interesting question arises. At one time it was possible to estimate a figure for those who appeared to be falling by the wayside. Since 2016, the currently released annual dataset no longer allows for this. However, I would guess at a deficit approaching a couple of million (including deaths) during the last 10 years where estimates were possible.

How should this be viewed? Not with surprise.

Paul lamented in his day "For there are many—I used to mention them often but now I mention them also with weeping—who are walking as enemies of the torture stake of the Christ." Ph.3:18.

Jesus experienced similarly: "He went on to say: “This is why I have said to you, no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.” Because of this, many of his disciples went off to the things behind and would no longer walk with him."John 6:65-66.

Our assignment as an organisation is to "Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations" Matt.28:19.
Our assignment as individuals is to "keep working out our own salvation" Ph.2:12.

Elders as shepherds in the congregations have a particular assignment not only to care spiritually for existing "sheep", but to go looking for the "lost" ones. Acts 20:28, Compare Luke15:4-7.

Presumably, all in your respective areas are carrying out their particular assignment diligently?

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Quote SM, "Butler, you are pulling old information, as I had address before, the demographics of adherents in this regard of the faith group have been increasing, especially an increase talk about God and the Bible. They will be hitting the 9mil mark soon."

Yes well I'm not including all the under 5 year olds and others that are forced to do the 'ministry'.

If you didn't include all those under 18 it would probably be a lot less too. 

Remembering that Jesus was 30 years old before he started his ministry.

And remembering that all children in most 'civilised' countries are in subjection to their parents whilst under 18. 

Probably the reason for such great turnover in the JW org, the young are forced to do the ministry or bribed to do it.  

But if the GB / JW Org want to call 3 year olds and 5 year olds, ministers of God, then so be it. Even if those young children are actually doing it against their will. 

 

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To quote BtK  " I also finished reading yet another ex-witness book published this year. I wish these people would find something new instead of the same old thing. Shunning, Disfellowship, 1914, Blah! Blah! Blah! "

They also have the CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE to write about, but strangely enough you didn't mention that kid.

 

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9 hours ago, Outta Here said:

Paul lamented in his day "For there are many—I used to mention them often but now I mention them also with weeping—who are walking as enemies of the torture stake of the Christ." Ph.3:18.

There is churn among Jehovah’s Witnesses but it is offset by a higher participation rate. After all, with many religions, members may not actually leave, but how would you know if they did?

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BTK maybe seems to forget that Jesus was actually being disobedient to his physical parents by not remaining with them for the journey home. Yes his place was in the temple but at the same time his place was with his parents too. 

But to compare children now to Jesus is just twisting the whole idea. BTK has a strange way of looking at things. 

Jesus was 'born' as a Jew, a member of God's chosen nation. Children now are not part of such a thing.  It is all totally different.

 

 

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Paul lamented in his day "For there are many—I used to mention them often but now I mention them also with weeping—who are walking as enemies of the torture stake of the Christ." Ph.3:18.

    Hello guest!
 

I don't see the word 'torture' anywhere. Is it another word that the GB / W/t / JW Org added ?  

 

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Paul lamented in his day "For there are many—I used to mention them often but now I mention them also with weeping—who are walking as enemies of the torture stake of the Christ." Ph.3:18.

There is church among Jehovah’s Witnesses but it is offset by a higher participation rate. After all, with many religions, members may not actually leave, but how would you know if they did?

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Total misuse of scripture. Back then there was only one Christian way to serve God through Christ. You were either in or out. 

Now there must be millions of 'christian' organisations all pretending to serve God. 

People become apostate to one religion by joining another. And so it is with JW Org. So until anyone can prove that the JW Org is the only way to serve God, then it's all hot air. 

Basically JW's serve the GB / Watchtower / JW Org. That is not serving God through Christ. 

 

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After all, with many religions, members may not actually leave, but how would you know if they did?

Yes TTH, but with many religions you are not blackmailed into staying either. 

In JW Org the blackmail is that none of your family will speak to you, your business may fail due to other JW's turning their back on it, your whole social life will be wiped out in one day. So due to this, many that are not brave, remain physically in. 

I could have remained physically in and sat at home and done nothing. How simple that would have been. I would still have had all that social life :) .  (joke). 

 

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3 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

People become apostate to one religion by joining another. ...until anyone can prove that the JW Org is the only way to serve God, then it's all hot air. 

They are all the same to him. ‘All roads lead to heaven’ resounds to him like a clarion call.

One wonders what would satisfy him. Seemingly, only Jesus physical return and one-on-one communication with him would do the trick. 

What of the reasons that he became a Witness in the first place—the clear answer as to why God allows suffering, the knowledge of what happens to people when they die, and even the reason that they die? He has forgotten all about it.

It is all “hot air” to him.

It frequently happens when ones leave the JW faith. They lose every ounce of spiritual discernment that they once had, to become completely immersed with matters of the here and now. In no time at all, if they have not gone atheist, they are praying to The LORD.

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the clear answer as to why God allows suffering, the knowledge of what happens to people when they die, and even the reason that they die? He has forgotten all about it. 

Are I see TTH is getting the Word of God, mixed up with JW org once again. 

TTH seems to think that JW's have the monopoly on God, Jesus Christ, and God's written word. 

My road does not lead to heaven Tom. If God shows me mercy and resurrects me then I will be here on planet Earth. 

"One wonders what would satisfy him" Why does one wonder ? I've written it on here often enough. 

A plain observation of the Anointed (spiritual 'Jew') that we should be clinging to. An organisation led by those Anointed that show proof of their being inspired of God. Such an organisation would of course be clean on the inside as well as the outside. Remembering the words of Jesus to the Pharisees. Wash the inside of the dish or bowl ................ And it would know how to use God's written word properly.

Quote " It frequently happens when ones leave the JW faith. They lose every ounce of spiritual discernment that they once had, to become completely immersed with matters of the here and now. "

It frequently happens with JW's that they are so blindly serving their masters the GB and it's orgs (plural), that they cannot see that the ones they serve have no spiritual discernment. And those said JW's cannot bare to look at the here and now as it is too painful for them to see how much of a mess their GB and orgs are in.

Works both ways Tom :) 

 

 

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    Hello guest!

When His parents saw Him, they were astonished, and His mother said to Him, "Son, why have You treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for You." 

So now, was Mary sinning to talk to Jesus like that ?  Or was Jesus wrong for not notifying his parents that he was staying behind ?  

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I think the Apostles did works to prove that they had God's guidance and that they were inspired by God's Holy Spirit. 

I agree that we all need to trust in God through Jesus Christ, but I do not trust the GB or JW Org at this time as they seem to prove themselves unworthy of God's approval. 

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19 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Are I see TTH is getting the Word of God, mixed up with JW org once again. 

The things Jehovah’s Witnesses have reinterpreted, or even flip-flopped on, are all superfluous things. They are all trimmings on the tree, and not the tree itself. The essential doctrines of Jehovah’s Witnesses that distinguish them from any other religion have been solidly established for over 100 years: teachings that the Trinity is unscriptural, for example, and that the soul does not live on after death. These are the important points that one should focus on. No one else figured it out. Forerunners of today’s Governing Body did, constituting powerful evidence that they are indeed led by God’s spirit.

Among the basic tenets discerned 100 years ago is that human salvation is not the prime issue before all creation, but the vindication of God’s name and purposes is.23 It is a huge distinction between Jehovah’s Witnesses and the general world of churches. It is the approach of the latter who say that it is all about us: all about our own personal salvation and relationship with Jesus. It invariably makes one self-centered. Invariably it leads to emphasis on rights outstripping responsibilities.

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TTH says "The things Jehovah’s Witnesses have reinterpreted, or even flip-flopped on, are all superfluous things "

Such as the 'Superior Authorities' for instance, and 'This Generation' for another. 

And such as not all Anointed are the faithful and discreet slave, only the GB. 

solidly established for over 100 years:  But altered many times in the process. Armageddon due in 1914, 1975 and now it 'so close' it's 'just around the corner'.  TTH you make me laugh. You are so blinded by your GB and all the other hierarchy in those two 'organisations'. 

The org didn't even figure out the name Jehovah, they 'stole' it from elsewhere. :) 

They are all trimmings on the tree, and not the tree itself.  No, the tree itself is Almighty God, Jesus Christ, the Anointed, God's written word, faith, love and mercy.  It does not include the GB or JW Org. 

And yes the purpose of Jesus coming to earth and giving his life willingly was to give glory to God in heaven. And the one through whom any human will get saved is Jesus Christ. 

Christ is our judge, having been given the authority and power by his heavenly Father.  

Unfortunately the GB of JW Org think they are our judges. They add further burdens to the shoulders of others, and will not even lift a finger to help.

The apostles said, recorded at Act 15 v 28 & 29  

For the holy spirit and we ourselves have favored adding no further burden to you except these necessary things:29  to keep abstaining from things sacrificed to idols, from blood, from what is strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you carefully keep yourselves from these things, you will prosper. Good health to you!”

Oh yes and look it says 'the holy spirit' which proves it was inspired. But your GB and hierarchy are not inspired are they ? 

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On 6/18/2019 at 11:47 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

solidly established for over 100 years:

For example:

Virtually unique to Jehovah’s Witnesses is the idea that when the person dies, the soul dies, for the two terms are synonymous. The dead are non-existent, pending future resurrection. Failing to recognize this leads to teachings that God ‘takes’ people, even children, for his ‘heavenly garden.’ It is a non-comforting slander against Him that may have tripped up even Darwin. Imagine how history might have played out differently had he been exposed to religious truth and not error. 

    Hello guest!

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By the way, Billy, are you and Foreigner the same person ? 

I notice he or she never makes any comments, and downvotes everything everybody else says, EXCEPT YOU,   You get an upvote!

....sort of like getting a Telly Award and not having to pay $85 for it.

This will be a good test of your basic integrity, as there are several people here ( not me ) who can determine from your Internet Cyber trail exactly where both logins are coming from, and even your operating system and Browser. They ALREADY have all that information.

You going to weasel out of this honest, straightforward, and pertinent question ....

..... or reply  with an honest YES or NO answer?

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  If you weasel word your answer, or don't answer, you could legitimately be re-labeled  :

                                             "Billy(Just Weasel)theKid46"

           ... notice that the "Just Weasel" is spelled with a capital "J", and "W", which you considered JW Insider's screen name to be an affront against God.

You wouldn't want THOSE SAME irrational fruitcake rules applied to YOU ..... now would you, huh Billy?

 

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10 hours ago, TrueTomHarley said:

For example:

Virtually unique to Jehovah’s Witnesses is the idea that when the person dies, the soul dies, for the two terms are synonymous. The dead are non-existent, pending future resurrection. Failing to recognize this leads to teachings that God ‘takes’ people, even children, for his ‘heavenly garden.’ It is a non-comforting slander against Him that may have tripped up even Darwin. Imagine how history might have played out differently had he been exposed to religious truth and not error. 

    Hello guest!

Couldn't you read the bible and figure that out for yourself ?  There are enough scriptures to tell you. 

'A resurrection of the righteous and the unrighteous'   

Buy Billy thinks some of us here won't get any resurrection, BTK thinks we are already condemned. 

I'd sooner believe God's words.  

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Was it unique to JW's and /or Bible Students that Christmas was an insult to God ? 

But they kept on celebrating it for 30 years.

Was it unique to the Bible Students  / JW's that smoking was against God's 'rules' or wishes ?

But they kept on doing it for over 70 years.

Was it unique to JW's that the Superiority Authorities were God and Jesus Christ ? 

Oh yes but that was a lie wasn't it. 

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On 6/18/2019 at 4:56 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

The essential doctrines of Jehovah’s Witnesses that distinguish them from any other religion have been solidly established for over 100 years: teachings that the Trinity is unscriptural, for example, and that the soul does not live on after death. These are the important points that one should focus on. No one else figured it out.

I found this: 9 Faith Groups That Reject the Trinity - 

    Hello guest!

I believe how same is with immortal soul. JW's are not only one who have this teachings. 

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3 hours ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Tom used the most basic ones to illustrate. Of course, there are far more than the ones quoted, that set the Watchtower apart from Christendom.

Oh,  you think, perhaps about; Shepherd - secret book for elders, or monthly service report, tablets and little vehicle full of publications on streets :))))) these for sure are not just Basic teachings/instructions but very unique to JW religion :)))   

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13 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

I found this: 9 Faith Groups That Reject the Trinity

    Hello guest!

 I believe how same is with immortal soul. 

Why did you have to go to learnreligions.com? Why couldn’t you just rattle them off the top of your head? You—who once specialized in religion.

There is admittedly some exaggeration, but not enough to derail the basic statement: 

On 6/18/2019 at 10:56 AM, TrueTomHarley said:

These are the important points that one should focus on. No one else figured it out.

 

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On 6/17/2019 at 6:43 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

Yes well I'm not including all the under 5 year olds and others that are forced to do the 'ministry'.

And yet this word of mouth claim of yours was dealt with the last time we spoke of demographics (twice), and if I recall, you unleash the circus and the mental gymnastics on said notion, an act that can easily be done away with a 3rd time if need be.

On 6/17/2019 at 6:43 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

Remembering that Jesus was 30 years old before he started his ministry.

Elementary stuff, Butler. Also, remember - Jesus was very very knowledge of the Scriptures as a child. In fact, all Jews take up and obverse God's Law very early. It is unknown if you were ignorant and or unaware of this, I advise you look into Shema Yisrael and all things that hang for it. Jesus speaks such for a reason.

On 6/17/2019 at 6:43 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

And remembering that all children in most 'civilised' countries are in subjection to their parents whilst under 18.

As is with Jesus, and all before and after him. It did not stop young ones from observing God's Law and reading the Scriptures. Again, if you actually read your bible and took up spiritual wisdom, you'd realize how the Jews operated, including Jesus, but you negate everything when you sibtract what took place before his ministry.

On 6/17/2019 at 6:43 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

Probably the reason for such great turnover in the JW org, the young are forced to do the ministry or bribed to do it.

Forced, I ask you before to give evidence of this, twice, but this word of mouth falls short. That is like the saying by some who say Christians force children to read the Bible, when in reality it is encouraged to do so.

But as was exposed on your account, your folly in the realm of statistics is as great as the light from the sun for discerning ones to see it and give a rebuttal.

On 6/17/2019 at 6:43 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

But if the GB / JW Org want to call 3 year olds and 5 year olds, ministers of God, then so be it. Even if those young children are actually doing it against their will. 

So where is the evidence in this regard to which was asked but never shown?

Remember, Jesus was a very young boy and it was wise in the Law of God, probably beyond both his human parents. He knew very well who his God and Father is and the context of his words found in Luke 2 passage shows, in fact, what one can see by reading and taking in the context and references of Luke 2:41-52 entirely.

A Christian parent are to encourage their children to seek the Scriptures and the truth and teachings that it brings, hence why it is said that we must pass on wisdom to the young ones, to teach them, despite being under their parents, the child has his or her choice to take up what is said, whereas the parent, who is of authority can encourage. 

Even outside of the realm of faith, this also comes in form in terms of education in and outside of the home, for it is no different concerning a child and the Scriptures.

That being said, with the you said here after this response of yours, I suggest you better read, understand, and mediate on the Bible, let alone study and teach yourself because the lack is clearly seen, hence your attempted exegesis expressed here.

Aside from that overwhelming fact in terms of demographics/adherents is factual over your lunacy, so much as so, even Rook is alluding to the research website that is accurate in terms of the faith group, as is with other faith groups. They would not sully their reputation for your unproven word of mouth info when nearly everyone is knowing of such facts, even the Christian Today folk.

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@BillyTheKid46 It is only going to get word. In today's society, people will jump out of their socks in a fit of rage on the level of a snowflake, a shill, or an SJW, etc. Concerning the Bible and Christians, it has gotten words, you have specific folk that are catering to things that is of Satan's design, in his world, and such has entered into the churches, and such is trying to pave it's way into other churches who are not equal to or like the mainstream.

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On 6/16/2019 at 10:57 PM, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

(PEW survey on Religion in America)

The Pews Research Website is and will always be a good source. But it is a pale of hot coals for those who can't take the statistics that solidifies truth.

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      Baptisms are usually held at assemblies and conventions of Jehovah’s Witnesses. At the conclusion of the baptism talk, the speaker will ask the baptism candidates to stand and answer the following two questions in a loud voice:
      1. Have you repented of your sins, dedicated yourself to Jehovah, and accepted his way of salvation through Jesus Christ?
      2. Do you understand that your baptism identifies you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with Jehovah’s organization?
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      So where are the words in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, " ?
      And where in the Bible does it say that a person gets baptised into an 'Organisation' ?
      Should the JW Org use the words that Jesus instructed to be used ? 
      Now a puzzling question. What actually is a JW Org baptism ? Sound like a stupid question ? Um. 
      If a baptised JW leaves the Org or is disfellowshipped, they are then shunned. So are they still a Christian ? 
      Does their baptism still count for anything ? 
      In the first century it would have been anointed ones that did the baptising. A baptised one, would become a Christian serving God through Christ. There was no IBSA, and no JW Org. (Although some on here try to pretend that the 1st Century Christians were JWs)
      So who now has the right to baptise ?  Should it be Anointed one's that baptise ? Therefore should it be made clear who are the Anointed ones ?
      I suppose it would be difficult to know who they are, and to have so few Anointed baptise so many earth wide. 
      But, by what authority do the Elders baptise ? And is it a true baptism as it is 'into the Org' not as Jesus first directed ?
      Does anyone else have the right to baptise and would it be recognised as such by God and Christ ?
      Add to this that if a person is reinstated into JW Org and then, wow, everyone can talk to them again, their original baptism into JW Org is ok, and they don't need to do it again. 
      How does any of that match up with God's written word ?  
       
       
    • By The Librarian
      Jehovah in the Bible, the God of Israel who 
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. , a spirit realm outside the physical heavens and is not omnipresent or "residing" in a human's heart.
      "Jehovah" at Exodus 6:3(1611 King James Version)
      Jehovah /dʒɨˈhoʊvə/ is a Latinization of the Hebrew יְהֹוָה, a vocalization of the Tetragrammaton יהוה (YHWH), the proper name of the God of Israel in the Hebrew Bible, which has also been transcribed as "Yehowah" or "Yahweh". יְהֹוָה appears 6,518 times in the traditional Masoretic Text, in addition to 305 instances of יֱהֹוִה (Jehovih).The earliest available Latin text to use a vocalization similar to Jehovah dates from the 13th century. 
      Relationship of Jehovah with the rest of the Universe
      Think of Jehovah as the Architect of the Universe and Jesus Christ as his "Master Builder" (Proverbs chapter 😎 through whom everything else was created. His first Creation was Jesus Christ himself Billions of years ago before the physical universe ever existed.

      Michael the Archangel (later called Jesus Christ) used God's Holy Spirit in order to create our Universe and later perform miracles related in the Gospels. All energy in the Universe sources with Jehovah God's Holy Spirit and later the exalted and enthroned Jesus Christ enthroned as King would be given "Life within himself" thereby also being given immortality and having his own spirit. (source needed) See also
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content. Jehovah's Witnesses Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  /  Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.
      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.  
       
    • By Witness
      The good news is not preached in all the world, as we understand it. 
      Paul talked about that being done, even in the first century. 
      He said of their work of preaching to the Jews; 
      "But I say, have they not heard? Yes indeed:
      ‘Their sound has gone out to all the earth,
      And their words *to the ends of the world.’* Rom 10:18

      That word "world", really means, "land". Not all lands, are the whole world.

      Paul also said;
      Col.1: "5 because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel, 6 which has come to you, *as it has also in all the world*"

      He was saying that the gospel was already heard, in the whole land.
      Verse 23 continues; "and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was *preached to every creature under heaven*, of which I, Paul, became a minister."
      Paul did not preach to the whole world. Yet he says that the gospel was preached to "every creature under heaven".
      Rev.14: 6 says; "Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach **to those who dwell on the earth**—to *every nation, tribe, tongue, and people"*.
      We may think from this, that everyone in the world is being referred to.
      But notice that the great crowd is described in the same way...

      "9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, **of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues,** standing before the throne and before the Lamb...) (Rev.7)

      Is the Great Crowd, the whole planet? No.
      Look at how the anointed priests and kings of God are described....

      "9 And they sang a new song, saying:
      “You are worthy to take the scroll,
      And to open its seals;
      For You were slain,
      And have redeemed us to God by Your blood
      **Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation**,
      10 And have made us kings and priests to our God;
      And we shall reign on the earth.” (Rev.5)

      They are not the whole world either.
      So they too, are described as "from all nations", but they are not the whole world.
      When Rev.14:6 tells us that the good news will be preached "to all those who dwell on the earth"... the word that was translated "earth", also means, a particular land and is occupied by people.
      In Revelation, the "earth" is not the "sea".
      The "sea" represents those who do not know God (see Isa.57:20). 
      The Land that does know God, and claims to worship him, and that land is translated into the word "Earth" (God's occupied land).
      So again, the good news is not toward the whole world, but toward God's people.
      Even though the gospel opened up to Gentiles of all nations, who were also added to God's people, notice that they also *become Jews, in their spirit*...

      "28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but *he is a Jew who is one inwardly*; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God." (Rom.2)
      Do you see that those of all nations, become spiritual Jews?

      Gal.3:28-29 agrees;
      "28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And **if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed**, and heirs according to the promise."
      If you become the seed of Abraham... you become a spiritual Hebrew.

      Rom.4: "16 Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham"
      So then,
      who did Jesus say we would be preaching to, and trying to reach with the truth?

      He said;
      "22 And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures *to the end* will be saved. 23 When they persecute you in this city, flee to another. For assuredly, I say to you, **you will not have completed preaching to the cities of Israel before the Son of Man comes."** (Matt.10)
      Did you notice who Jesus said, would be getting preached to?
      "The cities/towns, of Israel".
      What are the towns of Israel? 
      Jesus named them, in Revelation 1:11...
      "...“What you see, write in a book and send it to the seven churches which are in Asia: to Ephesus, to Smyrna, to Pergamos, to Thyatira, to Sardis, to Philadelphia, and to Laodicea.”
      The message being sent out to the "towns of Israel", is the opened scroll of Revelation. To understand that message, is good news....

      Rev.1: "3 Happy is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near."
      So from all this, we see that the good news is not preached to the whole planet, as JWs teach. Jesus said that we would not even finish preaching to "the towns of Israel" before he would return. The good news that is trying to reach God's people, is the true and full interpretation of the book of Revelation. That message reveals the truth, about who is wicked, and who is faithful. That is good news to those who have been slandered and thrown out as wicked, because they are the ones to receive the kingdom. Those who raised themselves up, will be humbled and condemned.        Pearl Doxsey, 4 womaninthewilderness
       

    • By JOHN BUTLER
      I was going to add this to another topic but remembered we are told to start new topics, so I've done that.
      Hope this hasn't been added before but it would take me a month to go through all the topics to see if its on here.
      It is about the baptism of children, but I also thing it involves making children go on the ministry. 

      Hello guest! Please register or sign in (it's free) to view the hidden content.
    • By JOHN BUTLER
      This brings me to an interesting question then.
      Can anyone baptise anyone else ?  If not then it brings  us back to the Clergy Class once more. 
      So, does a person need to be part of an Organisation to be able to baptise others ? 
      If we go back to Russell or Rutherford, whichever one of them it was that said an Organisation was not needed, then did they baptise others, even though they were not part of an Organisation ?
      And another question. What makes a person a Minister of God's word ?  Or a person able to baptise others ? 
    • By Bible Speaks
      Would You Walk on this Iceberg?
      Amazing Photo! Amazing God! 
      “Jehovah answered Job out of the windstorm:  2 “Who is this who is obscuring my counsel
      And speaking without knowledge?  3 Brace yourself, please, like a man;
      I will question you, and you inform me.  4 Where were you when I founded the earth?
      Tell me, if you think you understand.  5 Who set its measurements, in case you know,
      Or who stretched a measuring line across it?  6 Into what were its pedestals sunk,
      Or who laid its cornerstone,  7 When the morning stars joyfully cried out together,
      And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?
      22 Have you entered the storehouses of the snow,
      Or have you seen the storehouses of the hail,
      23 Which I have reserved for the time of distress,
      For the day of battle and war?"
      (Job 38:1-7, 22-23). 
      JW.Org
      #Repost @ladzinski
      ・・・
      Being stuck out at sea among the icebergs and sea ice can make you pretty restless and uneasy. Last July on an expedition in south east greenland we spent 6 days marooned in an ice flow at the mercy of the elements. @mikelibecki and @ethan_pringle seen here getting in a little exercise, jumping ship to climb this #iceberg. My favorite thing about this photograph is that this was Ethan’s first time ever wearing crampons and ice climbing, a very unlikely place for a lesson! @andy_mann @connor_seybert @3stringsproductions @mountainhardwear @dell @djigloba

    • By JOHN BUTLER
      I am having a thought about getting together with whomever, here in the UK,  and having some leaflets printed
      The leaflets would be to warn people about the Child Abuse within the Jehovah's Witnesses Organisation.
      Distribution would be by hand in the form of witnessing work.  
      The idea would be to bring praise to God whilst warning people, especially people with young children, against association with the JW Org at this time.
      Warning would also be to JW's that they can expect problems when on the ministry. Problems arising from people having the true knowledge about the Child Abuse.  
      Of course the leaflets would have to be factual, truthful, and not insulting. 
      Does anyone know how legal this would be to do this in the UK ? 
       
    • By The Librarian
      *** w1955 7/1 411    Christian Baptism for the New World Society *** 
      15 A Christian, therefore, cannot be baptized in the name of the one actually doing the immersing or in the name of any man, nor in the name of any organization, but in the name of the Father, the Son and the holy spirit. This shows, among other things, that Christianity is not a denominational affair, that sects have nothing to do with it. “Does the Christ exist divided? Paul was not impaled for you, was he? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? I am thankful I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, so that no one may say that you were baptized in my name.”—1 Cor. 1:13-15, NW. 
      *** w1966 10/1 603-4  Serving with Everlasting Life in View *** 
      15 This is what we mean when we dedicate our lives to Jehovah. We do not dedicate ourselves to a religion, nor to a man, nor to an organization. No, we dedicate ourselves to the Supreme Sovereign of the Universe, our Creator, Jehovah God himself. This makes dedication a very personal relationship between us and Jehovah. 
      --------------------------------------
      *** w1958 8/1 478  Baptism *** 
      22 It is essential that with the mouth a public declaration of faith be made. Two 
      questions are therefore asked the candidates: (1) Have you recognized yourself before Jehovah God as a sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his Son Jesus Christ? (2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit? 23 Everyone who can answer “Yes” to these questions is eligible for baptism and should take this step without hesitation or delay. 
      *** w1960 5/15 308  "What Prevents Me from Getting Baptized?" *** 
      23 The first question is: Have you recognized yourself before Jehovah God as a sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his Son Jesus Christ? 
      24 The second question is: On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit? 
      25 Everyone who has answered “Yes” to these two questions is eligible for baptism and should be baptized at that same circuit or district assembly of Jehovah’s witnesses. 
      *** w1973 5/1 280  Baptizing Follows Discipling *** 
      we suggest that you consider the following two questions, which are asked of 
      candidates for baptism: 
      (1) Have you repented of your sins and turned around, recognizing yourself before Jehovah God as a condemned sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his SonJesus Christ? 
      (2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit? 
      If you find that you can answer “YES” to these questions, then it would be appropriate for you to speak to the presiding overseer in the congregation of Jehovah’s witnesses with which you associate, with a view to getting baptized. 
      ------------------------------------
      *** w1985 6/1 30     Subjecting Ourselves to Jehovah by Dedication *** 
      The first question is: 
      On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will? 
      The second is: 
      Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization? 
      Having answered yes to these questions, candidates are in a right heart condition to undergo Christian baptism. 
      *** w1987 4/15 12  Gaining Peace With God Through Dedication and Baptism *** 
      By baptism you identify yourself as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s worldwide congregation.
      *** w87 4/15 12  Gaining Peace With God Through Dedication and Baptism *** 
      Recently the two questions addressed to baptismal candidates were simplified so that candidates could answer with full comprehension of what is involved in coming into intimate relationship with God and his earthly organization.
      *** w1989 1/15 13  What Prevents You From Getting Baptized? *** 
      for the first of two questions the speaker asks them is: “On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?” Only if the individual answers in the affirmative and also understands that his dedication and baptism identify him as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God’s spirit-directed organization can he acceptably undergo water immersion. 
      *** knowledge 176  18 Make It Your Aim to Serve God Forever *** 
       Baptism ‘in the name of the holy spirit’ signifies that the baptismal candidate 
      recognizes Jehovah’s holy spirit, or active force, as God’s instrument for carrying out His purposes and for empowering His servants to do His righteous will in association with His spirit-directed organization.
    • By Jack Ryan
      Modern JW Baptismal question contradicts previous Watchtower claims
    • Guest
      By Guest
      C'est moi le Potier dit Jéhovah Dieu 
      Tu es mon vase d'argile ! C'est moi qui t'ai modelé, façonné, 
      Une merveille au creux de ma main. 
      Tu n’es pas encore achevé, tu es en train de prendre la "forme" de mon Fils. 
      Voici que tu te désoles et que tu désespères 
      Parce que tu as pris quelques fêlures au contact des autres. 
      Tu t'es heurté, tu as été ébréché 
      Tu as même pu tomber par terre, te briser et tomber en mille morceaux 
      Fêlures, éraflures, lézardes, brisures, cassures, ratures... 
      N'oublie pas, c'est ta condition de vase. 
      Si je t'avais rangé dans un placard à vaisselle 
      Tu ne connaîtrais pas ces heurts de la vie 
      Mais tu ne servirais à rien ni à personne, tu serais un vase inutile ! 
      Moi, dit Dieu, j'aime les vieux vases, un peu usés, un peu ébréchés. 
      Ils ont toute une histoire, et toi, tu voudrais être lisse comme un nouveau-né ? 
      Je te connais, ô toi que j'ai façonné, pétri avec tant d'amour 
      Je ne voudrais pas que tu te désoles de tes ratées 
      Tu es fait de boue et de lumière, tu es fait pour servir ! 
      A ne regarder que tes failles, tes faiblesses et tes chutes 
      Tu te centres encore trop sur toi-même 
      Et tu restes prisonnier de tes failles ! 
      C'est moi le Potier et je m'y connais dans l'art de reprendre un vase. Laisse-toi faire ! 
      Avec mes doigts d’artiste, j'arrive toujours à rendre plus beau ce qui n'était que fêlure, brisure, cassure. 
      Je suis l’Esprit Créateur, ne l'oublie pas. Je crée ! Je mets la vie ! Je donne le souffle ! 
      Je suis le Potier ! C'est moi qui moule, qui pétris, qui donne la "forme" 
      Toi, mon vase d'argile, Viens te glisser au creux de mes mains paternelles et maternelles 
      Laisse-toi pétrir entre mes doigts d'artiste. 
      Abandonne-toi longuement à mon travail de potier. 
      Expose-moi tes fêlures, tes brisures, tes cassures ! J'aime faire du neuf, j'aime te regarder 
      Voici que je te réchauffe, ô toi mon argile 
      A force de te pétrir, je te communique ma chaleur, ma sueur, 
      mon souffle, mon intimité, ma chaude tendresse. 
      C'est moi le Potier, viens et n'aie plus peur. 
      Chaque fois que tu retombes dans ces fautes que tu ne voudrais pas commettre 
      Je te dis : Le pardon est là ! 
      Viens et continuons ensemble 
      J’aime te regarder, voir les efforts que tu fais et tout le mal que tu te donnes. 
      J'en éprouve grande joie et tu réjouis mon cœur 
      Je vois combien tu te transformes. 
      A l'abri de tes regards Je te modèle 
      A l'image du Fils bien-Aimé 
      Tout ce que je te demande 
      C'est de venir toujours et à nouveau après chaque chute 
      Entre mes mains pour me donner la joie de te remodeler. 
      Allons, n'aie pas peur       C'est moi le Potier 
    • By JOHN BUTLER
      "All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness,"
      2 Timothy 3 v 16
      Was this in it's way a small prophecy ?                 
      The 2nd book of Timothy was written 65 C.E.  However 1,2,3, John and Revelation were written much later.
      So we have two points, 1. The writings were not complete when Paul wrote that information. 2, The Bible had not been constructed so no idea would have been formed as to what the Bible would contain. 
      Were there other writings ? Would they be considered as Scripture? 
      It seems that Paul was inspired to write that "All scripture is inspired.... " 
       
    • By JOHN BUTLER
      This topic is aimed toward asking ADMIN these questions. I do not know who Admin are. Some folks here seem to have made friends with Admin where as I just use the forum. 
      Why was Jehovah's Witnesses Private Club set up ?
      Should it be 999% about Jehovah's Witnesses and their Organisation, which would include the GB ?
      Am I therefore wrong when i only talk about Jehovah's Witnesses and have no interest in other religions ?
      There are those on here that regularly 'bite my ears off' because i only talk about the JW's, but I thought that was the intention of this forum.
      Admin please clarify these matters for me, please ...... 
    • By JW Insider
      I have recently, just today, communicated again with Gerard Gertoux requesting permission to quote extensive long passages from his book on this topic as a basis for a more in-depth forum discussion. The Amazon link to his book is here:
      The Name of God Y.eH.oW.aH Which is pronounced as it is Written I_Eh_oU_Ah
      A subset of that same material is also found here:
      http://areopage.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Gertoux_UseNameEarlyChristians.pdf
      Gerard Gertoux has responded that it would be better to use  https://www.academia.edu/14029315 as it is a free version that all of us can download, and it has no copyright.
      Since this topic comes up now and then, under various topic headings, I hope that some might find it useful to understand the basics of his argument. He assumes a lot of background and expertise that many do not have, but the material is accessible enough so that we can all learn a lot about the topic and even about the related background material at the same time.
      Out of respect for the author's wishes, let's not make extensive quotes from the book or the "areopage.net" link above except where fair use might allow. And even the "academia.edu" content should only be quoted in reasonable portions to the extent that it is needed for discussion. I have also mentioned to the author that I will do my best to keep the topic from devolving into a discussion of the Trinity. I will try to keep the discussion on topic, which also means that it should not become a free-for-all with critiques of the New World Translation or the persons who may have worked on it.
      The topic will not revolve only around Gerard Gertoux's writing, but it's a good place to start. Feel free to bring in evidence from other authors and researchers if it is related to the questions. As a reminder the evidence we discuss should focus especially on the following questions:
      Did Jesus and the apostles and disciples of the first century use the Divine Name? Did they read it aloud when they came to it in the OT Scriptures? Did they include it (and therefore expect it to be used aloud) in the writings of the NT? [And, of course, feel free to use the terms OT and NT as abbreviations for "Hebrew Scriptures" and "Christian Greek Scriptures" respectively.]
    • Guest Nicole
      By Guest Nicole
      I was told by some other sisters that I have to wear a black T-Shirt instead of the normal bathing suit. Is this true?
    • By James Thomas Rook Jr.
      This afternoon (Saturday) was our weekend meeting, and the public speaker said that at the Orangeburg, SC Assembly last weekend it was said that the Brotherhood had dropped to 7,500,000 worldwide.
      It was my impression that we were at somewhere around 8.2 million, and growing.
      That means (if true) that even with several BILLION HOURS of public witnessing .... there was a net LOSS of 700,000 JWs.
      So, have we actually had that much decrease, and does anybody have any "official" numbers to verify what I heard today from the platform?
    • By The Librarian
      1934 Jehovah.mp3
      Talk by Judge Rutherford
       
      Part of the archive:
       
    • By The Librarian
      Part of a series on:
       
      ALMIGHTY.
      Heb., Shad·dai′, plural to denote excellence, occurs 41 times and is translated “Almighty” or “Almighty One.” (Ge 49:25; Ps 68:14) The corresponding word in the Christian Greek Scriptures is Pan·to·kra′tor and means “Almighty,” or, “Ruler Over All; One Who Has All Power.” (2Co 6:18; Re 15:3) The expression ʼEl Shad·dai′, “God Almighty,” occurs seven times in M and indicates that Jehovah has irresistible power.—Ge 17:1; Ex 6:3.
      ANCIENT OF DAYS.
      Aram., ʽAt·tiq′ Yoh·min′, meaning “One Advanced [or, Aged] in Days.”—Da 7:9, 13, 22.
       
      CREATOR. 
      Heb., Boh·reʼ′. (Isa 40:28; 42:5) GRAND CREATOR.—Ec 12:1.
       
      FATHER. 
      Heb., ʼAv; Gr., Pa·ter′; Lat., Pa′ter; as Creator (Isa 64:8); as giver of everlasting life to all those who exercise faith. (Joh 5:21) The expression “Holy Father” is used exclusively with reference to Jehovah.—Joh 17:11. Compare Mt 23:9.
      GOD. 
      Heb., ʼEl, without the definite article, probably meaning “Mighty One; Strong One.”—Ge 14:18.
       
      GOD. 
      Heb., ʼEloh′ah, singular of ʼElo·him′, without the definite article. It occurs 41 times in Job and 16 times in other books.—Job 3:4.
      GOD. 
      Heb., ʼElo·him′, without the definite article. In The American Journal of Semitic Languages and Literatures, Vol. XXI, Chicago and New York, 1905, p. 208, Aaron Ember wrote: “That the language of the O[ld] T[estament] has entirely given up the idea of plurality in אלהים [ʼElo·him′] (as applied to the God of Israel) is especially shown by the fact that it is almost invariably construed with a singular verbal predicate, and takes a singular adjectival attribute. . . . אלהים [ʼElo·him′] must rather be explained as an intensive plural, denoting greatness and majesty, being equal to The Great God. It ranks with the plurals אדנים [ʼadho·nim′, “master”] and בעלים [beʽa·lim′, “owner; lord”], employed with reference to human beings.” ʼElo·him′ draws attention to Jehovah’s strength as the Creator and occurs 35 times in the creation account.—Ge 1:1-2:4.
      GOD OF GODS (LORD OF LORDS).
      De 10:17; Da 2:47.
       
      GOD OF TRUTH. 
      Heb., ʼEl ʼemeth′, indicating that Jehovah is true and faithful in all his dealings.—Ps 31:5.
       
      GRAND GOD. 
      Aram., ʼElah′ rav.—Da 2:45.
       
      HAPPY GOD. 
      Gr., ma·ka′ri·os The·os′.—Compare 1Ti 1:11.
       
      HOLY GOD. 
      Heb., ʼElo·him′ qedho·shim′.—Jos 24:19.
       
      HOLY, HOLY, HOLY. 
      Heb., qa·dhohsh′, qa·dhohsh′, qa·dhohsh′. This expression as applied to Jehovah includes holiness, cleanness, purity and sacredness to the superlative degree.—Isa 6:3; Re 4:8.
      INDEFINITELY LASTING GOD. 
      Heb., ʼEl ʽoh·lam′.—Ge 21:33.
       
      INSTRUCTOR. 
      Heb., Moh·reh′. (Job 36:22) GRAND INSTRUCTOR.—Isa 30:20.
       
      I SHALL PROVE TO BE WHAT I SHALL PROVE TO BE.
      See Ex 3:14 ftn.
       
      JEALOUS. 
      Heb., Qan·naʼ′, meaning “Insisting on Exclusive Devotion.”—Ex 34:14; see also Eze 5:13.
       
      JEHOVAH GOD.
      Ge 2:4. See App 1A.
       
      JEHOVAH OF ARMIES (JEHOVAH OF HOSTS) (LORD OF HOSTS). 
      (This expression with minor variations occurs 283 times in M. It also occurs twice in the Christian Greek Scriptures where Paul and James quoted or alluded to prophecies in the Hebrew Scriptures. (See Ro 9:29; Jas 5:4.) The expression “Jehovah of armies” indicates the power held by the Ruler of the universe, who has at his command vast forces of spirit creatures.—Ps 103:20, 21; 148:2; Isa 1:24; Jer 32:17, 18. See App 1E.
      KING OF ETERNITY. 
      Gr., Ba·si·leus′ ton ai·o′non.—Compare 1Ti 1:17.
       
      KING OF THE NATIONS. 
      Heb., Me′lekh hag·goh·yim′.—Jer 10:7.
       
      LIVING GOD. 
      Heb., ʼElo·him′, with the plural adjective chai·yim′ (De 5:26); or with the singular adjective chai (Isa 37:4, 17); Gr., The·os′ zon.—Compare Heb 3:12.
      MAJESTY. 
      Gr., Me·ga·lo·sy′ne, denoting his lofty, superior position. (Compare Heb 1:3; 8:1.) MAJESTIC ONE. Heb., ʼAd·dir′.—Isa 33:21.
      MAKER. 
      Heb., ʽO·seh′. (Ps 115:15; Jer 10:12) GRAND MAKER.—Isa 54:5.
       
      MOST HIGH. 
      Heb., ʽEl·yohn′.—De 32:8; Ps 9:2; 83:18.
       
      MOST HOLY ONE. 
      Heb., Qedho·shim′, plural to denote excellence and majesty.—Pr 30:3.
       
      OVERSEER OF YOUR SOULS.
      1Pe 2:25.
       
      THE ROCK. 
      Heb., hats·Tsur′. (De 32:4) Figuratively used to describe Jehovah’s qualities as perfect, just, faithful, righteous and upright; as father (De 32:18); as a stronghold (2Sa 22:32; Isa 17:10); as a secure height and refuge (Ps 62:7; 94:22); as a source of salvation.—De 32:15; Ps 95:1.
      SAVIOR. 
      Heb., Moh·shi′aʽ (Isa 43:11; 45:21); Gr., So·ter′.—Compare Lu 1:47.
       
      SHEPHERD.
      Ps 23:1; 1Pe 2:25.
       
      SOVEREIGN LORD.
      Ge 15:2; Lu 2:29. See App 1E.
       
      SUPREME ONE. 
      Aram., ʽEl·yoh·nin′.—Da 7:18, 22, 27.
       
      THE [TRUE] GOD. 
      Heb., ha·ʼElo·him′.—See App 1F.
       
      THE [TRUE] GOD. 
      Heb., ha·ʼEl′.—See App 1G.
       
      THE [TRUE] LORD. 
      Heb., ha·ʼA·dhohn′. -
    • By Jesus.defender
      BIBLE PROOFS OF THE TRINITY

      Key: The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are so clearly and consistently linked in Scripture that, assuming that God is not three persons, makes it impossible to understand some passages.
      Though JWs exalt human reasoning against the Trinity doctrine, saying it is unreasonable,those who submit to God’s Word must conclude that it is unreasonable to doubt the Trinity.
      Consider these scriptures proving the Trinity:
      1. Matthew 28:19 The ‘Name’ of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.

      Watchtower teaching: JWs ask, ‘Does this verse prove the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are equal in substance, power and eternity?’ They say, ‘No, no more than listing three people
      Tom, Dick and Harry mean that they are three in one.’ They say that the Trinity doctrine is imposed on the text, not derived from it.

      Bible Teaching: The key point is that the word ‘name’ is singular in the Greek NT, thus proving that there is one God, but three distinct persons within the Godhead.
      This proves the Trinity because Jesus did not say:
      i) ‘into the names (plural) of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.’
      ii) ‘into the name of the Father, and into the name of the Son, and into the name of the Holy Spirit’, as if we had three separate beings.
      iii) ‘into the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit’ omitting the three articles (the), as if the Father, Son and Holy Spirit might be three designations of a single person.
      What He does say is: ‘into the name (singular) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit’.
      Jesus first teaches the unity of the three by combining them all within a single name.
      He then teaches that each is a different person by introducing each of them in turn with the
      article (tou):
      Question: Can you see that rules of grammar dictate plurality (the, the, the) within unity (the name), because the word ‘name’ is singular and definite articles (Greek: tou) are placed in front of Father, Son and Holy Spirit?
      Other verses showing ‘three-in-oneness’ of the Godhead are:
      i) At the creation of man, ‘God said, let us make man in our image, after our likeness . .’ (Genesis 1:26). ‘Our image’ in v. 26 is explained as God’s image in v. 27.
      The one true God consists of three persons who are able to confer with one another and carry out their plans together, while still being one God.
      ii) After the Fall, ‘the Lord (Jehovah) God (Elohim) said, Behold, the man is become as one of us . ’ (Genesis 3:22)
      ‘Us’ refers back to LORD (Jehovah), showing plurality within the Jehovah Godhead.

      iii) At the Tower of Babel, ‘the LORD (Jehovah), said . . let us go down’ (Genesis 11:6,7).
      iv) Isaiah ‘saw the Lord (Adonai) sitting upon a throne (v.1) mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD (Jehovah) of hosts (v.5). I heard the voice of the Lord (Adonai) saying: ‘Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?’’ (Isaiah 6:1,5,8) Here Isaiah sees ‘Adonai’ on the throne, then Isaiah calls Him ‘Jehovah of hosts’ (v.5).

      Then Adonai asks,‘Who will go for us?’The ‘us’ shows plurality in the Jehovah Godhead. This equivalence of Adonai and Jehovah (both called ‘us’) proves the Trinity Godhead.
      2. Genesis 18 and 19. Three men each called Jehovah.
      JWs believe that it is impossible for Jehovah God to exist as three persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Yet Genesis 18 and 19 shows Jehovah appearing to Abraham as three men. This
      shows that even the impossible from a human viewpoint is possible with God. Notice that:

      i) Abraham addresses the three as ‘Jehovah’ (v.3 NWT);
      ii) When two of the three men depart to visit Lot in Sodom, Abraham continues to address the remaining one as ‘Jehovah’ (Genesis 18:22,26,27,30,31,32,33).
      iii) Lot addressed the other two as ‘Jehovah’ (Genesis 19:1,18 NWT). ‘Then Lot said to them: “Not that please, Jehovah”.’ (19:18 NWT)
      iv) ‘Then Jehovah made it rain sulphur and fire from Jehovah, from the heavens upon Sodom and Gomorra.’ (Genesis 19:24)
      Notice the mention here of two Jehovahs, one in heaven who sends judgment on Sodom and Gomorra, at the bidding of the other Jehovah on earth.
      This gives strong evidence for more than one person in the Godhead. The Jehovah upon earth was one of three persons to visit Abraham, one of whom stays behind to speak further to Abraham and is called Jehovah. (Genesis 21:1 ‘Jehovah turned his attention to Sarah’).
      Hence this shows that it is possible for Jehovah to manifest Himself as three-in-one.
       
      3. II Corinthians 3:17 - ‘Jehovah is the Spirit’ (NWT).
       
      JWs challenge Christians to prove the Trinity in the Bible. This can be done if we find verses teaching that the Holy Spirit is Jehovah God, and the Son is Jehovah God.
      II Corinthians 3:17 teaches this by saying: ‘Now Jehovah is the Spirit.’

      How much clearer can it be than this, which states that the Holy Spirit is (=) Jehovah God? This proves the Deity of the Holy Spirit, and the existence of 2 persons in the Godhead.
      4. I John 5:7,8 The Johannine Comma, the famous Trinitarian proof text (3 Heavenly witnesses)
      Watchtower teaching: JWs claim that this passage ought not to be in the Bible, because it is not in most Greek manuscripts. It is omitted by most modern Bible versions. ’
      Bible Teaching: Erasmus omitted it from his first edition of the printed Greek NT (1516), because it occurred in the Latin Vulgate and not in any Greek manuscript. To quieten the
      outcry that followed, he agreed to restore it if it could be found in one Greek manuscript.
      Two Greek manuscripts, Codex 61 and 629 were found, so Erasmus included it in his 1522 edition. Since these manuscripts are late (14th and 15th Century), some think the readings are
      corrupt. What do we answer? (See page 805-806).

      5. In II Corinthians 13:14, (the Apostolic Benediction) why is there a change in the order of the persons of the Trinity, compared to Matthew 28:19, if not to show that ‘in this Trinity
      none is before or after the other, and none is greater or less than another’?

      ‘The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.’ (II Corinthians 13:14)
      ‘Baptising them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.’ Matt. 28:19
    • By Jesus.defender
      Isaiah 9:6 - Is Jesus ‘a Mighty God’ or ‘Jehovah God’?

      ‘His name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, the Mighty God (410), the Everlasting
      Father, the Prince of Peace’.
      Watchtower teaching: JWs concede that Jesus is a ‘mighty God’, but they are adamant that
      He is not Almighty God as Jehovah is. They think that Christ is one of lesser gods.
      Bible teaching: The Bible shows that both Jesus and Jehovah are called ‘Mighty God’.
      Jehovah is called ‘Mighty God’ in:
      a) ‘The remnant of Israel . . . shall stay upon Jehovah, the remnant of Jacob shall return . .
      unto the mighty God (410)’. (Isaiah 10:20,21).
      b) ‘the Great, the Mighty God (410), Jehovah of hosts, is his name’. (Jeremiah 32:18).
      Because Jehovah and Jesus are both called ‘Mighty God’, this proves Christ’s equality with
      God the Father.
      Ask: Since Jehovah is called ‘Mighty God’ (Isaiah 10:21) just as Jesus is called ‘Mighty
      God’ (Isaiah 9:6), doesn’t this mean that the Watchtower is wrong in saying that ‘Mighty
      God’ means a lesser deity?
      Ask: If both Jesus and Jehovah are ‘Mighty God’, then what does this tell you about Jesus’
      divine nature?
      Ask: If both Jesus and Jehovah are equally ‘Mighty God’, then isn’t this two members of
      the Trinity?
      Note: There is only one Mighty God in heaven:
      a) ‘I am the first and I am the last; beside me there is no God (430)’. (Isaiah 44:6b)
      b) ‘Is there a God (433) besides Me? Yea, there is no God; I know not any’.(Isaiah 44:8b).
      c) ‘I am the Lord (YHWH), and there is none else,there is no God beside me’(Isaiah 45:5a)
      The NWT translates John 1:1 as ‘the word was a god’.
      Isaiah 44:8b shows this to be false by denying the existence of ‘a god’ other than Jehovah.
      The phrase ‘Mighty God’ is ‘Elohim’ in Hebrew, meaning ‘Fullness of power’, portraying
      Christ as the ‘powerful Governor of the universe’.
      Notice that ‘Elohim (430)’ is also used to describe Jehovah God as:
      i) ‘The God (430) of the whole earth’. (Isaiah 54:5)
      ii) ‘The God (430) of all flesh’. (Jeremiah 32:27)
      iii) ‘I prayed to the God (430) of heaven’. (Nehemiah 2:4)
      iv) ‘For the Lord (YHWH) your God (430) is God (430) of gods....a great God.’(Deut 10:17)
      In Isaiah 40:3 Jesus is called both Jehovah (3068) and Elohim (430) in the same verse:
      ‘Prepare ye the way of the Jehovah, make straight in the desert a highway for our God (430)’.
      Mark 1:3 and John 1:23 apply Jehovah here to Jesus.
      Question: What is meant by calling Jesus ‘Everlasting Father’?
      Since Jesus is not the Father, why does Isaiah call Jesus ‘Everlasting Father’?
      Answer: Jesus considers the Father as someone other than Himself over 200 times in the NT.
      ‘Everlasting Father’ in Isaiah 9:6 means ‘Father of eternity’.
    • By Jesus.defender
      JEHOVAH’S NAME or JESUS CHRIST’S NAME.

      The Watchtower teaches that God’s true Name is Jehovah. They teach that:
      ‘Sometime during the second or third Century CE, the scribes removed the tetragrammaton (JHWH) from both the Septuagint and the Christian Greek Scriptures and replaced it with κυριος (Lord) or θεος (God)’. Reference Edition of NWT, 1984, p 1564.
      The Watchtower’s Kingdom Interlinear Translation (KIT) proves that Jesus is Jehovah God.
      On page 10,11 of the 1985 KIT, under the heading ‘Restoring the Divine Name, Jehovah’ we read: ‘the evidence (what evidence?) is that the original text of the Christian Greek Scriptures has been tampered with (no proof) . . . Sometime during the second or third centuries CE, the Tetragrammaton (YHWH) was eliminated from the Greek texts by copyists (no proof).
      Instead of YHWH they substituted the words Kurios (‘Lord’) and Theos (‘God’).’
      Note: This is a lie. There is no historical or manuscript evidence or evidence of protest to support this claim. Somebody would have protested such a change.No one did. It never happened.
      The New World Translation (NWT) is the JW perversion of the Bible made to support their false doctrines. It inserts the name ‘Jehovah’ in the New Testament in the place of God (θεος=theos) or Lord (κυριος =kurios) on 237 occasions, where they believe it refers to God the
      Father. They often refer to Hebrew translations of the NT to see where this has been done.
      These are footnoted as J1 to J27. Their dishonesty and deceit is shown by their failure to translate these words as ‘Jehovah’ when it refers to Christ. (eg: Philippians 2:11; Hebrews 1:10).
      JWs say that the proper use of God’s ‘correct’ name (Jehovah) is absolutely essential to one’s salvation. They quote from their NWT: 
      ‘Everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved.’ Romans 10:13 (NWT).
      ‘People will have to know that I am Jehovah.’ Ezekiel 39:6 (NWT).
      JWs believe that because they are the only group who refer to God by His ‘true’ name, Jehovah, they are the only true followers of God.
      Their claim is false for these reasons:
      1) Jehovah is not a Biblical term. It is a man-made term. The Old Testament has YHWH because the original Hebrew only had consonants. Jews feared taking God’s name in vain, so when they publicly read YHWH, they would pronounce it ‘Adonai’ (Lord).
      Later they inserted the vowels from Adonai (a-o-a) into the consonants YHWH to give YAHOWAH, which became Jehovah. Hence, the word Jehovah comes from a consonantvowel
      combination from YHWH and Adonai.
      2) No-one knows for sure the original correct pronunciation of YHWH. Hence we cannot insist on ‘Jehovah’ as being correct.
      3) Jesus never addressed the Father as Jehovah in the New Testament. If JWs are correct that God must be always called Jehovah, then Jesus was sinning by not calling God ‘Jehovah’. When the NWT puts Jehovah in Jesus’ mouth in the NT, it contradicts all the NT manuscripts which don’t have it.
      QUESTION: Since Jesus never in the NT addressed the Father as Jehovah, why should we?
      4) Jesus and the Apostle Paul tell us to address God as ‘Father’:
      a) Jesus taught us to pray to God as ‘Our Father’, not ‘Our Jehovah’: ‘After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father.....’ (Matthew 6:9).
      b) Jesus addressed God as Father in His own prayers:
      ‘I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth’. (Matthew 11:25).
      ‘O my Father, if it be possible.......’ (Matthew 26:39,42).
      ‘He said, Abba, Father.......’ (Mark 14:36).
      ‘ I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven.......’ (Luke 10:21).
      ‘Saying, Father, if thou be willing.......’ (Luke 22:42).
      ‘Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them;.......’ (Luke 23:34).
      ‘Father, the hour is come......’ (John 17:1).
      c) Paul said, ‘we cry, Abba, Father.’ (Romans 8:15).
      d) The Holy Spirit through Paul said, ‘God hath sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father’. (Galatians 4:6).
      Here the Holy Spirit of God tells us to call God ‘Abba, Father’, not ‘Jehovah’
      QUESTION: If Jesus, the Holy Spirit and Paul all address God as Father nine times (and never as Jehovah) then shouldn’t we call God ‘Father’?
      5) No Ancient NT manuscripts contain the tetragram (YHWH) to translate as Jehovah.
      The Church writers before 325 AD only mention Jehovah once in passing. JWs tell us that most Bible versions deceive people because they omit Jehovah as God’s Name, so
      the JWs dishonestly add the word ‘Jehovah’ to the NT text, even though it is not in any NT Greek manuscript, ancient version, papyri or lectionary.
      The WT’s claim that ‘Jehovah’ as God’s name was removed from the NT by superstitious scribes, is a total lie with no supporting historical or manuscript evidence.
      6) Whose Name did the early Christians identify themselves with? Was it Jehovah or was it Jesus Christ? Always Jesus Christ, never Jehovah.
      Who knows more, the Apostles or modern JWs? Consider these examples:
      a) The Apostles never used the name ‘Jehovah’.
      b) The Apostles and first century Christians were never called ‘Jehovah’s Witnesses’. ‘The disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.’ (Acts 11:26).
      c) There is no proof that Jesus or his disciples ever pronounced the tetragram YHWH. 
      JWs claim that when Jesus read from Isaiah 61:1 ‘The Spirit of the Lord is upon me....’ as quoted in Luke 4:18,19, that Jesus pronounced the word ‘YHWH’.
      This is most unlikely. JWs assume that the religious leaders endorsing Christ’s ‘gracious words’ in verse 22 was because He uttered the name YHWH?
      Historical records in the Mishnah, from Josephus, and from other sources show the Jews were loathe to allow the name YHWH to be used. The Jews would not have tolerated it being used by anybody but the High Priest.Jesus would have read ‘Adonai’
      7) 119 Bible passages referring to Jehovah, are quoted and applied to Christ in the New Testament (Proof Available)
      QUESTION: In view of 119 Bible verses applying ‘Jehovah’ to Christ in the NT, what does this tell you about who Christ is?
      ? The New Testament tells us to name the name of Jesus Christ, not the name of Jehovah. Consider these examples:
      1. ‘Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.’(II Timothy 2:19)
      2. ‘I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ . . .’ (I Cor 1:10)
      3. ‘Ye are washed,....sanctified,... justified in the name of the Lord Jesus ’ (I Cor 6:11)
      4. ‘Whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus.’ (Col 3:17)
      5. ‘That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you....’ (II Thess 1:12)
      6. ‘Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves.....’ (II Thess. 3:6)
      7. ‘all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours.’ (I Corinthians 1:2)
      8. ‘Thou holdest fast my name....’ Jesus said to the Pergamos church. (Revelation 2:13).
      JWs have not held fast Christ’s name, nor have they called upon Christ’s name, nor do they name the name of Christ, nor is Jesus Christ precious to them, because they do not have saving belief in Him. ‘Unto you . . . which believe He is precious’.(I Peter 2:7).
      QUESTION: Where does the NT tell us to name the name of Jehovah?
      9) The New Testament always lifts up Jesus Christ’s name, not Jehovah’s name. Why?
      Because Jesus Christ is Jehovah God on earth. Christ is 100% God and 100% man.
      Q1: In whose name should we meet together?
      ‘Where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.’ (Matthew 18:20)
      Q2: Demons were cast out by the authority of whose name?
      ‘Paul.....said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her.’ (Acts 16:18)
      Q3: In whose name should we preach repentance and forgiveness of sins? ‘And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations. And ye are witnesses of these things.’ (Luke 24:47,48)
      Q4: In whose name are we to believe and receive forgiveness of sins? ‘....through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.’ (Acts 10:43, John 1:12)
      Q5: By whose name, and no other, do we obtain salvation? Acts 4:10,12 says: ‘by the name of Jesus Christ ... Neither is there salvation in any other, for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.’
      Q6: In whose name should we pray? John 16:23,24; 14:13,14; 15:16 says: ‘Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.’
      Q7: In whose name is the Holy Spirit sent?
      ‘But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name......’ (John 14:26)
      Q8: In whose name and authority did the disciples heal the sick?
      ‘His name through faith in his name hath made this man strong’ (Acts 3:16; 4:30)
      Q9: Whose name did Paul say that we are to call upon?
      ‘ all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord.’ (I Cor 1:2)
      Q10: Whose name is above every name?
      ‘God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name .... that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord.’(Phil 2:9-11)
      Paul’s quote about Christ is from Isaiah 45:22-24 where every knee will bow to Jehovah. What is true about Jehovah, is also true of Christ, the Lord of all mankind
      Q11: According to Acts 1:8, of whom are we to be witnesses?
      ‘Ye shall be witnesses unto me (Jesus)’
      Q12: In whose name were believers baptized?
      ‘they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus’. (Acts 8:16; 2:38)
      Q13: In whose name were believers designated?
      ‘the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch’. (Acts 11:26)
      Q14: In whose name did the apostles speak?
      ‘Commanded them not to speak at all nor teach in the name of Jesus’ Acts 4:17,18
      Q15: In whose name did early Christians suffer? Acts 15:26 says:
      ‘Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.’ ‘rejoicing that they were counted worthy to suffer shame for his name’Acts 5:41;9:16
      Q16: Whose name was Paul to carry?
      ‘Lord said: He is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, kings, and the children of Israel.’ (Acts 9:15)
      Q17: In whose name did Paul deliver a man to Satan?
      ‘In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ...to deliver such an one to Satan.’ I Cor 5:4,5
      Q18: In whose name did the apostles teach? Acts 5:28; 8:12 says:
      ‘Did we not straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name?’
      10) Why does WT break their own rule (where the OT speaks of Jehovah), that they do not insert Jehovah in the NT, when the quote clearly refers to Christ?
      Peter quotes from Joel 2:32 (spoken of Jehovah) and applies it to Jesus in Acts 2:21 and 38.
      Calling on the name of Jehovah for salvation equals repenting and being baptised in the name of Jesus Christ because of the forgiveness of sins.
      Conclusion: Jesus shares the nature of His Father and His Name. The absence of YHWH in any NT manuscript demolishes the WT case of introducing the word ‘Jehovah’ into the NT.
      Question: If God was so concerned about preserving His covenant name, why did the apostles not preserve it in their writings?
      Question: To imply that the name ‘Jehovah’ is the main name of God that we are to use, contradicts the continued NT use of the name ‘Jesus’ on 900 occasions, while the tetragram YHWH is used nowhere in the NT.
      QUESTION: Why does the WT not translate ‘Jehovah’ into Hebrews 1:10, I Peter 3:15 andPhilippians 2:11, when the OT passages from which these are quoted refer to YHWH?

      We are to make the name of the Father known as Jesus emphasized (Matthew 6:9; John 17:26). How do we do it? By recognizing that Jesus Christ was chosen by the Father to embody all the glory and important reputation of that Name.
       
    • By Queen Esther
      Very  rare  and  never  seen  in  Europe...   a  SO  young  sister  before  her  baptism !
      But  I  saw  it  in  pic's  and  reports  -  its  really  true !!   I  will  soon  post  it  here...
      Its  great  -  how  mature  the  kids  in  Asia  and  Africa...    wow ! 
    • Guest Nicole
      By Guest Nicole
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